Παντα

Courses, resources and discussion on Greek language.
If you know of a good link or course please post it.
George
Posts: 236
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2013 3:59 pm
Location: Scotland

Παντα

Postby George » Wed Nov 06, 2013 11:03 am

Are there different pronunciations for the word παντα; When I used the Michel Thomas cd's the word was pronounced as panda. I have now started attending Greek classes at night school and have been assured that the correct way to say it is padda. Could this be a difference due to regional dialects? Also, I was told that you never use the word χαίρετε after 2 o'clock in the afternoon which my teacher said was nonsense. Can anyone enlighten me?

YoMo2
Posts: 905
Joined: Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:07 am
Location: Milatos, Lasithi

Postby YoMo2 » Wed Nov 06, 2013 11:31 am

If you listen to a Greek say παντα, you will hear practically no difference between the two versions you describe, so I would not worry about it. The correct version is panda. Sometimes the vt dipthong is pronounced as a d, which is where the confusion may have arisen.

Since χαιρετε means "be joyful", I cannot see why it would be restricted to a certain time of the day. Are we not allowed to be joyful after 2pm? I use it all day long and have never been corrected.

You should however, substitute καλισπερα for καλιμερα after 2pm - maybe more confusion there?

Andrew

'Γεια Χαρα..........

Kilkis
Posts: 8905
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 3:58 pm
Location: Near Chania

Postby Kilkis » Wed Nov 06, 2013 1:46 pm

I think the vt dipthong is normally pronounced as a d if it is at the beginning of a word and nd if it is in the middle. Similarly with μπ being b at the beginning and mb in the middle. I am sure there are exceptions, as there usually are when it comes to language, but that is the norm.

When it comes to transliteration of foreign words you simply need to know which it is, i.e. you need to know how the foreign word sounds in its own language. For example my surname has bs in the middle. When transliterating into Greek the only available combination is μπ. They have to be pronounced b not mb even though it is in the middle.

Warwick

filippos
Posts: 5352
Joined: Mon Feb 05, 2007 7:38 pm
Location: Kalyves
Contact:

Postby filippos » Wed Nov 06, 2013 3:32 pm

Kilkis wrote:Similarly with μπ being b at the beginning and mb in the middle. I am sure there are exceptions, ........
One exception I've been told is that if a word begins with 'μπ' and that combination is repeated later in the word, both are spoken as 'b'.

As you say, languages are full of exceptions to 'rules'.

George
Posts: 236
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2013 3:59 pm
Location: Scotland

Postby George » Wed Nov 06, 2013 5:14 pm

I was led to believe that what you said meant "be joyful" was Greek for hello! There is another site (explore Crete) which also said it shouldn't be used after 2 o'clock which I thought was rather bizarre. I'll just stop visiting inferior websites.

YoMo2
Posts: 905
Joined: Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:07 am
Location: Milatos, Lasithi

Postby YoMo2 » Thu Nov 07, 2013 11:51 am

George, in effect it is hello. It's just one of many ways to greet someone in Greek. When you think about it, there are many ways to do it in English too.

Hello
Good morning
Good day
Good afternoon
Good evening
What's up man
How's it hanging?
Eyoop

And so on.

Andrew

Roussa
Posts: 104
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2011 5:03 pm
Location: Eastern Crete

Postby Roussa » Thu Nov 07, 2013 1:51 pm

The correct pronunciation is panda.

When you consider that a lot of people on this island have only been to school for 6 years or less and they also had two different languages back then - lots of them have never learned the rules.
It´s the same with pende ( five ) . You can hear many people say pede.

Makes me wonder though what teacher you have at night school.

SatCure
Posts: 1912
Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2007 9:57 pm
Location: Apokoronas

Postby SatCure » Thu Nov 07, 2013 10:33 pm

You can state the "correct" pronunciation till you are blue in the face but there's a different dialect in every village. I was trying to describe lost gloves in one village and I pronounced it "gádia". They couldn't understand me. Turns out they say "gánteea" with a distinct "n" and "t" sound. No "d" sound at all!

P.s., Roussa, I think you are hitting the "acute accent" key instead of the apostrophe key.

here's the apostrophe
here´s the accent

filippos
Posts: 5352
Joined: Mon Feb 05, 2007 7:38 pm
Location: Kalyves
Contact:

Postby filippos » Thu Nov 07, 2013 11:40 pm

SatCure wrote:here's the apostrophe
here´s the accent
Blimey, does it matter? The meaning's clear.

Kilkis
Posts: 8905
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 3:58 pm
Location: Near Chania

Postby Kilkis » Fri Nov 08, 2013 12:25 am

Fancy people having different accents/dialects? You wouldn't get that happening in the UK.

You cannot deny that there is a correct way to pronounce all these words and the fact that some Greek people don't use it isn't really a good reason for foreigners to learn incorrect pronunciation.

Would you recommend a Greek person learning English to translate, "
Ξέρετε τι εννοώ;" as "Ye knaa what ah mean leik?" I am sure if you used Received Pronunciation anywhere in the UK you would be understood. They might think you are a bit odd but they would understand you. Try using a broad accent/dialect from one region in a completely different area of the country and you might not be so lucky. It's the same with standard Greek anywhere in Greece.

There is a small speaker button on Google translate. Put the English word into the translate box, check the Greek word is the one you want or select a different one and click on the speaker. Try it with "ever", which is where this thread started, and, to my rather ancient ears at least, it definitely says "panda". I suspect that Satcure was corrected because he said "Gadia" and not "Gandia". Whether the person he was talking to appears to say it nt rather than nd is irrelevant. Did they have any teeth in for example? Many of the people I encounter in the village don't and that changes how they sound quite a bit.

Warwick

YoMo2
Posts: 905
Joined: Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:07 am
Location: Milatos, Lasithi

Postby YoMo2 » Fri Nov 08, 2013 10:27 am

Obviously, we all mean Yandia rather than Gandia, but no matter. And if you want to hear correct Greek spoken, you're on the wrong island. Crete has one of worst/heaviest regional accents in Greece.....

Bit like Newcastle or Glasgow.

Andrew

George
Posts: 236
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2013 3:59 pm
Location: Scotland

Postby George » Fri Nov 08, 2013 10:31 am

Roussa said;

[quote]Makes me wonder though what teacher you have at night school

My teacher is a born and bred Greek from Thessaloniki who is bringing the class along at a terrific rate compared to the other forms of self learning.

I'm not trying to be pedantic about things, just trying to get it right. Thanks for the informed replies.

Kilkis
Posts: 8905
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 3:58 pm
Location: Near Chania

Postby Kilkis » Fri Nov 08, 2013 10:39 am

George wrote:...My teacher is a born and bred Greek from Thessaloniki...


At the next class ask him, "Είσαι Πόντιος;".

This is one example where the "ντ" is pronounced "nt".

Warwick

filippos
Posts: 5352
Joined: Mon Feb 05, 2007 7:38 pm
Location: Kalyves
Contact:

Postby filippos » Fri Nov 08, 2013 12:12 pm

YoMo2 wrote:Obviously, we all mean Yandia rather than Gandia,
I assume that's γάντια / ΓΑΝΤΙΑ;

YoMo2
Posts: 905
Joined: Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:07 am
Location: Milatos, Lasithi

Postby YoMo2 » Fri Nov 08, 2013 12:39 pm

Kilkis wrote:At the next class ask him, "Είσαι Πόντιος;".


LOL, we may be getting a little obscure here Warwick.....

Andrew


Return to “Learning Greek”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest