Verb conjugation

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George
Posts: 234
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2013 3:59 pm
Location: Scotland

Verb conjugation

Postby George » Wed Jul 30, 2014 4:41 pm

If anyone has problems conjugating their Greek verbs then I stumbled across this site which may prove helpful.....

http://cooljugator.com/gr/

margarita
Posts: 420
Joined: Sat Jan 20, 2007 9:36 pm
Location: Kalyves area

Postby margarita » Wed Jul 30, 2014 10:11 pm

That looks very useful. Plenty of verbs to choose from.

I have bookmarked it. Thank you.

Maggie

johnincrete
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Location: Chania

Postby johnincrete » Sat Aug 02, 2014 10:50 am

I was talking with my daughter who is fluent in Greek (Married to a Cretan) and a well educated Greek lady about the inadequacies of the two Greek courses I have been on. I learnt a lot of grammar but still could not have a conversation with a local. Then I thought about overhearing the teaching of English to Greek students at my daughter's school - they learn grammar tenses that I have never heared of. My daughter is very keen that they also learn to communicate.

The fact is that any language is a means of communication - if you get your point across, it does not matter if you get gender or tense wrong. Just listen to an English conversation - how grammatical is it? It's the same with Greek (I am told by Greeks).

The web site is very clever (but cluttered up by adverts). It may be useful to anyone who is doing Greek homework or writing something but pretty useless to anyone who wants to SPEAK Greek. It presupposes you know the Greek verb - what happens if you want to know how to say, for example, "It's my birthday barbecue on Saturday. Plenty of meat and drink" - ungramatical and full of unspoken meaning.

What we need is more Greek conversation classes.

Kilkis
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Postby Kilkis » Sat Aug 02, 2014 12:23 pm

johnincrete wrote:...It presupposes you know the Greek verb ...


Since there is one in every sentence, doesn't communicating anything presuppose you know the word for the idea you are trying to communicate? The site doesn't remove the need to learn vocabulary.

Even if you know the verb, however, it is pretty difficult to get over any reasonably accurate meaning if you don't at least know how to express something that happened in the past and something that is going to happen in the future unless you only ever discuss what is happening now. If you say, "I live in Crete but I live in England" because you don't know the past tense of "live" the person you are talking to is going to be pretty confused.

Most Greek verbs are "regular", i.e. they follow rules. Learning the rules means that you can construct different tenses quite easily. The site helps especially with "irregular" verbs, i.e. those that don't follow the rules. There aren't a huge number but there are some pretty key ones.

The site also leaves out many tenses but it still useful because it contains so many words.

Warwick

George
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Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2013 3:59 pm
Location: Scotland

Postby George » Sun Aug 03, 2014 3:06 pm

johnincrete wrote:


What we need is more Greek conversation classes.


Whilst I totally agree with this, they are somewhat difficult to find. I have tried several classes, night school courses, on line teaching and so on. They all put a very heavy emphasis on grammar, but the teaching methods vary greatly. I am now getting my head around the "stem" idea with the differing endings depending on whatever tense I should be using. The site in question I find very handy, perhaps due to my limited knowledge of Greek. I will find out in October when I am back in Crete if my linguistic skills have improved any.

SatCure
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Location: Apokoronas

Postby SatCure » Sun Aug 03, 2014 5:26 pm

Kilkis wrote:Most Greek verbs are "regular", i.e. they follow rules.

Ha ha but I picked a good 'un. I was talking about a friend who sold something. I knew that "I sell" is "poulaw" (Πουλάω) so, logically, "he sold" should be "epoule" (έπουλε).

No, of course, it's "poulise" (πούλησε) - irregular.

So, for me, the conjugation web site is handy for the occasional look-up.

BTW, in winter, we have conversation classes in or near Vamos. In summer I simply chat with the locals but I try to choose the ones with teeth!
Last edited by SatCure on Mon Aug 04, 2014 12:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Kilkis
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Postby Kilkis » Sun Aug 03, 2014 5:40 pm

George wrote:...I am now getting my head around the "stem" idea with the differing endings depending on whatever tense I should be using...


This site gives quite a good description of combining the two different stems with the two groups of endings, together with prefixes such as θα and να to form the different tenses for regular verbs. The same principle applies to irregular verbs but the stem tends to change more.

http://www.foundalis.com/lan/grkverbs.htm

Warwick

PS Satcure, my dictionaries gives "I sell" as "πωλώ" or "πουλώ" not πουλάω. In either case the third person singular aorist indicative is as you say.

ScotinCrete
Posts: 250
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Location: Gavalachori

Postby ScotinCrete » Sun Aug 03, 2014 6:23 pm

My teacher is well aware that my grasp of grammar - both English and Greek - is poor at best :oops:
She does say though that it is better to use the wrong tense of the verb than to not try speaking Greek at all. Only very rarely, if at all, will anyone laugh at, rather than with, you for forgetting the conjugation of an irregular verb. If they understand the context then its fine. Wouldn't do it for business or where money is involved though.

Typing this makes me think of how the UK in general looks down on anyone who can't speak 'proper' English :cry: and The treatment of regional variations is another topic completely - our teacher still laughs at the english, scots [Glaswegian] and irish pronounciatiosn of mirror respectively :lol:

Kilkis
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Postby Kilkis » Sun Aug 03, 2014 6:43 pm

In any country in the world it is better to try than not try. I recently visited the Dordogne region of France and managed to navigate my way round shopping and restaurants in French having not really learnt any for over 50 years and not being very good at it then. I have no idea what they made of the liberal scattering of Greek words. When travelling around to many countries when I was younger I found leaning the local words for hello, goodbye, yes, no, please, thank you, the word for beer and how to count up to ten was a pretty good starting point. It's a pity some ex-pats can't even mange please and thank you in English let alone in Greek.

Warwick

filippos
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Postby filippos » Sun Aug 03, 2014 10:14 pm

Kilkis wrote:
George wrote:PS Satcure, my dictionaries gives "I sell" as "πωλώ" or "πουλώ" not πουλάω. In either case the third person singular aorist indicative is as you say.
My dictionaries (the one I trust most is Stavropoulos) show the same but, according to our Greek teacher, they have alternative 'άω' endings.

For example, Google translate comes up with I speak for both μιλώ and μιλάω: ditto for "πουλώ" and πουλάω etc.

Also, one of the standard text books used by Greek teachers "Επικοινωνήστε Ελληνικά" shows only the "άω" endings for many such words: I'm hungry - "πεινώ" in Stavropoulos "πεινάω" in Google and Επικοιν........ Lots more like those, too.

No wonder we find Greek tricky.

Kilkis
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Postby Kilkis » Sun Aug 03, 2014 10:23 pm

Thinking about it further you are probably correct "ω" and "αω" endings are pretty much interchangeable.

Warwick

George
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Location: Scotland

Postby George » Sun Aug 03, 2014 10:41 pm

filippos wrote:
Also, one of the standard text books used by Greek teachers "Επικοινωνήστε Ελληνικά"



Is this book available in Crete? I can order it here but they are wanting £56 for a new one. I saw them on ebay from Greece for £28, but the postage was quite expensive. I tried one bookshop in Spili but they didn't know it.

Kilkis
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Postby Kilkis » Mon Aug 04, 2014 8:32 am

My wife bought hers from a book shop in Chania but I'm not sure if it is still there. It was directly opposite the War Museum in the triangular block at the corner of Solomou and Tzakanaki Street. They weren't cheap but I can't remember exactly how much. They are not really suitable for a complete beginner unless they are being used in conjunction with a teacher. All the instructions of what to do are in Greek. There are three levels I think plus a couple of additional thinner exercise books with each one.

It looks like they are also available from ebooks.gr for €18.38 for each one. On http://tinyurl.com/qds5zzu When I use the link book 1 is at the top of the page and books 2 and 3 are on the bottom line but the link does seem to change what else is displayed each time it loads so I cannot guarantee this. You would need to ask about the exercise books. There is a telephone number and email address at the bottom of the page.

Warwick

PS Sorry for the messy looking link but it does work. Edited to give shorter link as suggested by Filippos below.
Last edited by Kilkis on Mon Aug 04, 2014 9:59 am, edited 2 times in total.

filippos
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Postby filippos » Mon Aug 04, 2014 9:34 am

Kilkis wrote:There are three levels ............
Our Greek teacher (who is both Greek and a school teacher) reckons book 3 is not worth bothering with: better to simply sit around and chat.

The bookshop opposite the War Museum has closed as has another that used to be in Halidon. There's another worth trying in the small street off Tzanakaki that's about opposite the tax office & the old post office building. From the Tzanakaki end the shop is on the right after about 150m.

There's a new bookshop in Kalyves where 'Er Indoors thinks she's seen one of the books: we'll check later.


Kilkis wrote:PS Sorry for the messy looking link but it does work.
Why not use the Google link shortener or TinyURL.com (or one of several others). They reduce links to about 20 characters or fewer.
e.g. http://goo.gl/mUxhzy

Kilkis
Posts: 8775
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Postby Kilkis » Mon Aug 04, 2014 9:56 am

filippos wrote:Why not use the Google link shortener or TinyURL.com (or one of several others). They reduce links to about 20 characters or fewer.
e.g. http://goo.gl/mUxhzy


I thought people had found that if the link appears as character codes, as the above one does, the shorteners didn't work properly. It turns out they do so I have edited the post.

Warwick


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