Tim wrote:If anyone wishes to read the draft Withdrawal Agreement in full, and the outline political statement on future relations with the EU, it is here in pdf format:
Philb wrote:scooby wrote:There's a lot of things Brexitards say make me laugh.
Classy, real classy
peebee wrote:Philb wrote:scooby wrote:There's a lot of things Brexitards say make me laugh.
Classy, real classy
A bit like your use of 'remoaner'
I'm sorry Maud but nobody knows the cost to the UK and in a true democracy the country needs to leave the EU. How that is done is down to the powers that be.Maud wrote:May has addressed the CBI today looking for their backing for the deal that is on the table. The situation has now become one of.....‘accept this deal....or end up with a no deal’ scenario. My concern is that if over two years no answer has been resolved to the ‘backstop’ situation, how is that going to change in the future? Surely if there was a sensible option it would have been found by now? We are now in ‘panic mode’ and grasping at ways to keep all channels open, and as a result not pleasing anyone.
What May still does not grasp is that public opinion might possibley have changed. I am not saying it has, but there is a strong possibility that the majority of U.K. citizens are now against Brexit.....all be it a small majority, just like it was in the original referendum. People see jobs being lost and investment being taken elsewhere in Europe. See the excerpt below.....
May received the backing of Carolyn Fairbairn, the head of the CBI, who warned that UK firms were cancelling investments in Britain.
Speaking before the prime minister’s address, she said one company had scrapped a £100m investment in the north-east of England that had instead gone to eastern Europe. Although refusing to name the company, she warned the anecdote represented a “pattern” of behaviour among major companies against a backdrop of no-deal Brexit.
She said: “Our firms are spending hundreds of millions of pounds preparing for the worst case – and not one penny of it will create new jobs or new products.
“While other countries are forging a competitive future, Westminster seems to be living in its own narrow world, in which extreme positions are being allowed to dominate.”
Raab was on the Andrew Marr show yesterday accusing the EU of bullying the U.K. Such extreme language does nothing to assist negotiations over Brexit. He also still states that no deal is better than a bad deal. - The word bullying is Johnson and Rees-Mogg language as usual. Theses are the politicians who want Brexit for their own career gain and power. An extra £10 on their shopping bill every week is not going to bother them, neither are job losses in the NE and other areas. As long as they are in power, they will be happy. What they cannot cope with is being told what to do by others.......which is why they are so anti the EU.
Sadly this ‘get back control’ and ‘the will of the people’ mantra, along with claims of bullying by UK politicians against the EU, has generated a loathing of the EU by many people, (who also don’t like being told what to do!), and has led to a number of people voting for Brexit. Some of those people now see the economic cost to themselves and the country, and are ready to vote to remain. Of course, the far right Brexiteers in the government know this.......hence not wanting another vote. Unfortunately May is blinded by the fact that she feels her party (and herself), will ‘lose face’ if she puts another vote to the people, so she is ploughing on regardless claiming ‘The people of the U.K. voted for Brexit.’ - She must have been very bad at maths at school!
I agree with Warwick in that any question posed by a ‘People’s Vote’ would be difficult to phrase. I still believe that in a true democracy however the U.K. public should be given the opportunity to vote on any deal now they know the cost to the U.K. people and the country.
Maud wrote:I agree with Warwick in that any question posed by a ‘People’s Vote’ would be difficult to phrase. I still believe that in a true democracy however the U.K. public should be given the opportunity to vote on any deal now they know the cost to the U.K. people and the country.
Did you watch the debate I put up? 3 remainers and 3 leavers?Maud wrote:Your last paragraph is what I was inferring to in my post Bob, and it is correct.
I agree with you up to a point Guy, and I also think the current deal is the best we are going to get.....but that doesn’t make what is happening right. As Bob has just clearly explained again, surely it is time to take stock and look at the who picture. Is it really ‘the will of the people’ any longer to leave the EU? Surely it makes sense to be sure the majority of people in the U.K want Brexit, now that we all understand the problems involved? I have NO problem with a majority vote, whichever way it goes, as long as it is truly what the U.K. public want.
This is not being undemocratic Scooby. What is democratic about asking the people re the referendum, and not asking them again now they know what leaving the EU will mean to the U.K? - And as for not knowing the cost of Brexit, even Johnson and Rees Mogg have admitted that the next 10 years will be financially difficult for the country. (Mogg even mentioned 50 years!). Do you really see that as a good thing for the U.K. and its people? If you dispute that, then you have not read the article from the CBI properly. Please read Carolyn Fairbain’s comment.
Jeffstclair wrote:Yeah, that is what this divisive thing was designed to do.. and has done ...I too am very anti tory party... but I hope they don't stay in power and see this dreadful thing through properly ....
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