A TINY glimmer of hope - Health Ins

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altohb
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Location: Sitia

A TINY glimmer of hope - Health Ins

Postby altohb » Thu Aug 08, 2019 4:48 pm

Received this via email today. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/healthcare-for-eu-and-efta-nationals-living-in-the-uk?utm_source=d5f2ad23-4de1-4f14-a08b-e62506b5862f&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=govuk-notifications&utm_content=immediate#s1-certificate

Looks as if EU citizens will have S1 rights respected in England, at least. Clearly it will take a considerable amount of work for all EU (and others) countries to reciprocate, but its a start.

Have spent the last few days getting quotations for health insurance, and it isn't pretty.

Yin&Yang
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Re: A TINY glimmer of hope

Postby Yin&Yang » Thu Aug 08, 2019 5:13 pm

And if you are over 74 then you cannot get it at all.
Someday is now : )

Kilkis
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Re: A TINY glimmer of hope

Postby Kilkis » Thu Aug 08, 2019 5:16 pm

Agreed, Yin&Yang. It's neither pretty nor ugly - just a vacuum.

Warwick

bobscott
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Re: A TINY glimmer of hope

Postby bobscott » Fri Aug 09, 2019 8:41 am

Just looked at my e-mail today and in the link https://www.gov.uk/guidance/uk-nationals-in-the-eu-benefits-and-pensions-in-a-no-deal-scenario#uk-pensions-and-benefits There is this relating to a no-deal BREXIT:

"UK pensions and benefits

The UK leaving the EU will not affect your entitlement to continue receiving your UK State Pension if you live in the EU, EEA or Switzerland.

The UK government would wish to continue uprating pensions but will take decisions in light of whether, as we would hope and expect, reciprocal arrangements with the EU are in place.

You will continue to receive other UK benefits that are in payment while you are living in the EU, EEA or Switzerland after Brexit, as long as you meet the eligibility criteria."

With regard to the second paragraph, I fail to see what reciprocity has to do with anything! Why should the UK care if EU countries uprate the pensions of their citizens living in the UK? Don't get it. Bob.
Yesterday today was tomorrow. Don't dilly dally!

bobscott
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Re: A TINY glimmer of hope

Postby bobscott » Fri Aug 09, 2019 8:56 am

Meanwhile, there is this on healthcare in a no-deal scenario: https://www.nhs.uk/using-the-nhs/healthcare-abroad/healthcare-when-travelling-abroad/healthcare-in-greece-including-greek-islands/

.......... and the relevant extract is:
"After the UK leaves the EU

If the UK leaves the EU without a deal, your access to healthcare when visiting Greece is likely to change. If you are planning to visit Greece after the UK leaves the EU, you should continue to buy travel insurance so you can get the healthcare treatment you need, just as you would if visiting a non-EU country.

The UK government is seeking agreements with countries, including Greece, on healthcare arrangements for UK nationals after the UK leaves the EU.

This guide will be updated with further information on travelling to Greece as the circumstances change.

Bob.
Yesterday today was tomorrow. Don't dilly dally!

Kilkis
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Re: A TINY glimmer of hope

Postby Kilkis » Fri Aug 09, 2019 9:44 am

bobscott wrote:...With regard to the second paragraph, I fail to see what reciprocity has to do with anything! Why should the UK care if EU countries uprate the pensions of their citizens living in the UK? Don't get it. Bob.


The reciprocity referred to is not just on uprating but on all pension issues. Usually reciprocal pension agreements are quite wide ranging and cover a lot of issues, e.g how are contributions in different countries dealt with, who pays the pension and what determines that etc etc.

All governments would love to find a reason to not uprate pensions if they could get away with it. Fortunately most governments have to function under rule of law. They can make whatever law they want, provided they can get it through parliament, but once they have made a law they have to work within that law. The UK has made a quite general law that it will only uprate pensions for people living in countries where they have a reciprocal pension agreement with the UK. Some countries, for whatever reason, don't want to have a reciprocal agreement with the UK or at least not under the sort of terms the UK government would want. UK citizens living in those countries don't get their pensions uprated. If the UK government cannot reach a full reciprocal pension agreement with countries like Greece when it has left the EU but continued to uprate pensions of UK citizens living in Greece then it would lay itself open to a legal challenge from UK citizens living in every other country where there is no agreement.

It is a bit, but not exactly, like the winter fuel allowance. For many years they didn't pay it to pensioners living abroad. That was challenged within the EU on the grounds that it discriminated against people on the basis of where they lived within the EU which is against EU law. The challenge was successful and the UK government started to make the payments to EU residents. They then very rapidly changed the law to base the right on mean winter temperature. They chose the hottest part of the UK as the reference, so everybody living in the UK would still qualify but many in the EU would not. They then discovered that UK citizens living in France, which is a significant number of people, would still qualify so they modified the rule to incorporate overseas territories, i.e. in the case of France those in the Caribbean and the Indian Ocean. It didn't get them out of paying altogether but it excluded some of the biggest ex-pat concentrations in Spain, France, Italy and Greece.

They do the same thing with benefits. They create a new benefit so they can brag about how they are caring for people and so win votes but make it extremely difficult to claim the benefit. I once filled out the forms to claim carers' allowance for my mother. Everything that was allowed under the scheme she would not have contemplated under any circumstances, e.g. somebody coming to the house to wash her. Everything she desperately needed and could not live an independent life without was excluded from the scheme. She got the benefit so I guess my creative writing skills are better than I thought.

Warwick

bobscott
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Re: A TINY glimmer of hope

Postby bobscott » Fri Aug 09, 2019 1:45 pm

I can see where you are coming from Warwick and I suppose I have to take the cynical view. Sod the people, let's just do our best to present a caring face whilst making sure we pay as little as possible - even to our own nationals who have made all of the necessary contributions to the pension; are saving us money by being ill overseas where medical treatment is cheaper than in the UK; and by the way, pity about the exchange rate!! Bob.
Yesterday today was tomorrow. Don't dilly dally!

scooby

Re: A TINY glimmer of hope

Postby scooby » Fri Aug 09, 2019 2:01 pm

Bit off topic but just been looking at the Isle of Man, it’s amazing what a tiny island can achieve, not in the eu not part of the uk (although they are crown dependent), zero tolerance to crime with the lowest re offending rate in Europe and unemployment at around 1%. Its a low tax economy and I wonder if that’s the way Boris wants to take us. Check it out.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isle_of_Man

Howard
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Re: A TINY glimmer of hope

Postby Howard » Sat Aug 10, 2019 8:23 am

Is it true that private health insurance is not available for someone over 74?

bobscott
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Re: A TINY glimmer of hope

Postby bobscott » Sat Aug 10, 2019 8:55 am

Howard wrote:Is it true that private health insurance is not available for someone over 74?


Let this forum know if you find health insurance for over 74's! Preferably for over 80's too!!

Bob.
Yesterday today was tomorrow. Don't dilly dally!

Kilkis
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Re: A TINY glimmer of hope

Postby Kilkis » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:40 am

I think health insurance can continue past the limit age provided you already have it before you hit the limit age. I don't know if that is time restricted, in the sense that you must have had it for x years for it to continue, or age restricted, in the sense that even if you already have it there is some age where it will cease. The premiums will certainly increase each year.

I think that, with Greek companies, it is difficult (impossible?) to get it for the first time after 65, although that may have increased (going to increase?) to 67. After that I think it is only available from foreign companies that offer international health insurance. I'm told that is pretty expensive.

Purely my understanding from talking to other people so not a definitive answer. I don't have direct experience. I use a mixture of IKA and my bank account to provide health cover.

Warwick

Keltz
Posts: 187
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Re: A TINY glimmer of hope

Postby Keltz » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:56 am

scooby wrote:Bit off topic but just been looking at the Isle of Man, it’s amazing what a tiny island can achieve


In the context of Brexit and those who will increase their wealth with No Dea,l the islands main income is Casino capitalism and worldwide headquarters of an online gambling business. Basically headquartered businesses that do not want to pay tax and will move elsewhere at the drop of a hat and inflict job loss and poverty on the local population to protect their wealth.
http://theconversation.com/the-isle-of- ... oots-87146

scooby

Re: A TINY glimmer of hope

Postby scooby » Sat Aug 10, 2019 10:40 am

Keltz wrote:
scooby wrote:Bit off topic but just been looking at the Isle of Man, it’s amazing what a tiny island can achieve


In the context of Brexit and those who will increase their wealth with No Dea,l the islands main income is Casino capitalism and worldwide headquarters of an online gambling business. Basically headquartered businesses that do not want to pay tax and will move elsewhere at the drop of a hat and inflict job loss and poverty on the local population to protect their wealth.
http://theconversation.com/the-isle-of- ... oots-87146
Crystal ball?

Yin&Yang
Posts: 582
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Location: Megala Horafia/Aptera

Re: A TINY glimmer of hope

Postby Yin&Yang » Sat Aug 10, 2019 10:51 am

Andrew was insured with an American company through a Greek agent and as soon as he hit 74 they would not insure him. The agent could offer no other insurance.
Someday is now : )

Kilkis
Posts: 11091
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 3:58 pm
Location: Near Chania

Re: A TINY glimmer of hope

Postby Kilkis » Sat Aug 10, 2019 12:39 pm

How old was he when he first took out the policy, Lynn?

Was it really "an American Company" or was it Interamerican? If the latter it is legally a Greek company but is owned by Achmea Group, which is a Dutch company.

Warwick


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