Withdrawal Agreement and Our Rights

Temporary Forum - Please keep it CIVIL and ON TOPIC regarding updates/ news / concerns on British living / travelling in the EU.
Kilkis
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Re: Withdrawal Agreement and Our Rights

Postby Kilkis » Sat Dec 21, 2019 10:04 am

My feeling is the same as yours, Bob, but I really don't have the energy to go through PART 2 TITLE III word by word looking up all the cross references to other Directives and Regulations. The UK government knows very well what the issues are that give concern to ex-pats. The government already has a web site giving advice to ex-pats. Now the Withdrawal Agreement is virtually certain to go through and applies to all EU member states I don't understand why they don't post a summary on the advice web site dealing with each issue in simple terms that anybody can understand. I presume they understand what is in the Withdrawal Agreement, although I recognise that is a massive assumption. As far as I can see most of the advice dates back to September when the Withdrawal Agreement was not certain and talks mainly about what happens in the even of no deal, whatever that meant.

Warwick

bobscott
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Re: Withdrawal Agreement and Our Rights

Postby bobscott » Sun Dec 22, 2019 8:44 pm

Yes Warwick - info seems to be dated somewhat. It is disappointing that the appearance given by governments in Athens and London is that they still haven't properly grasped the nettle about what is rattling many cages here. Hence the silly stuff which is still the latest, telling us (magnanimously - or is that just me being biased?) they are going to give us time to 'make alternative arrangements.'
Bob.
Yesterday today was tomorrow. Don't dilly dally!

Kilkis
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Re: Withdrawal Agreement and Our Rights

Postby Kilkis » Mon Dec 23, 2019 9:50 am

I am surprised that they haven't added a footnote saying something along the lines of: "If you can't make alternative arrangements with EOPYY or a private insurance company there is a clinic in Geneva that can help you to make alternative arrangements that will at least stop you bugging the government."

Warwick

Carolina
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Re: Withdrawal Agreement and Our Rights

Postby Carolina » Mon Dec 23, 2019 5:21 pm

Phil C wrote:Hi all,
Sorry to ask such a base question but time is a little tight for me possibly. I am in the process of buying a property in Crete. I will use this for extended stays with my wife who may stay a little longer. My question is do I need to register for residency before 31 January 2020 or can it wait later but before 31 December 2020?
I have a tax number and bank account is being sorted as I type. Hop to have the deal completed in January 2020. Obviously it would be ideal if this helped me maintain rights as they are now. I am aware of the 90 day rule. I hope I have made myself clear I am a little concerned I could miss the first date. Thank you for any reply.


You have until the 31st December 2020 to register for residency in Greece.
http://brexit.gov.gr/uk-citizens-in-greece/

This has also just been confirmed by the British Ambassador in Athens, Kate Smith, on a video post (20th December) on the Embassy Facebook page here https://www.facebook.com/BritsInGreece/

Voni
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Re: Withdrawal Agreement and Our Rights

Postby Voni » Sun Jan 05, 2020 1:40 pm

From the Greek reporter yesterday, Info on a Greek government bill relating to the rights of British ex pats after Brexit

https://greece.greekreporter.com/2020/0 ... er-brexit/

bobscott
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Re: Withdrawal Agreement and Our Rights

Postby bobscott » Sun Jan 05, 2020 2:31 pm

Voni wrote:From the Greek reporter yesterday, Info on a Greek government bill relating to the rights of British ex pats after Brexit

https://greece.greekreporter.com/2020/0 ... er-brexit/



We have the UK government saying they will be willing to pay healthcare costs for UK pensioner expats in the EU and now Greece saying "– (The Bill) establishes the reciprocal social security rights and healthcare of British citizens in Greece."

On that basis, provided the two governments can get together, ALL WILL BE WELL ! Let's hope so. Bob.
Yesterday today was tomorrow. Don't dilly dally!

GlennB
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Re: Withdrawal Agreement and Our Rights

Postby GlennB » Sun Jan 05, 2020 3:40 pm

bobscott wrote:
Voni wrote:From the Greek reporter yesterday, Info on a Greek government bill relating to the rights of British ex pats after Brexit

https://greece.greekreporter.com/2020/0 ... er-brexit/



We have the UK government saying they will be willing to pay healthcare costs for UK pensioner expats in the EU and now Greece saying "– (The Bill) establishes the reciprocal social security rights and healthcare of British citizens in Greece."

On that basis, provided the two governments can get together, ALL WILL BE WELL ! Let's hope so. Bob.


I join you in hoping so, but one issue I see is that Greece only has to get together with one country (the UK), whereas the UK has to get together and come to an arrangement with 27 other countries.

I was also a bit concerned with the way the UK put it - "willing to pay ...", which includes Greece having to make applications to get their money back, whereas I believe it's pretty automatic at the moment. I think.

bobscott
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Re: Withdrawal Agreement and Our Rights

Postby bobscott » Sun Jan 05, 2020 4:39 pm

As I understand it, EU countries can strike up agreements on a one-to-one basis with the UK, and are not dependent on a united 27-nation front being proposed by the EU. Already France has made some kind of 'arrangement' with the UK, or at least a 'proposal' to the UK, independent of the EU. Am still hopeful.

At the moment, it is up to the Greek government to claim back from the NHS. At the beginning of this whole saga, our Vamos health centre staff couldn't be bothered to fill in (by hand) the application forms and that went on for at least 18 months, if not 2 years. Once computerisation became the norm for handling prescriptions etc, I think the application would have been made centrally, based on submissions by individual doctors/health centres. In any civilized country that's how I imagine it would work .................! Bob.
Yesterday today was tomorrow. Don't dilly dally!

Kilkis
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Re: Withdrawal Agreement and Our Rights

Postby Kilkis » Sun Jan 05, 2020 8:41 pm

I think you are correct, Bob. Under the existing EU reciprocal agreement on healthcare, each country has to claim from the other country when they provide medical services that the other country is responsible for paying. All they need to do is to agree to continue with the process, nothing new is needed.

One of the perpetual complaints by the anti-EU media, usually the Daily Mail, was that the UK didn't get paid for treatment rendered to citizens of other EU countries. That wasn't a problem with the EU system but the simple fact that NHS hospitals etc do not see themselves as debt collectors. In Greece whenever you go into a hospital, private or public, the first thing you are asked is what insurance do you have. In the UK it was always just assumed you were entitled to healthcare so nobody asked.

Warwick

bobscott
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Re: Withdrawal Agreement and Our Rights

Postby bobscott » Mon Jan 06, 2020 1:54 pm

The other problem Warwick is the Daily Mail and one or two others point up the imbalance between the amount the UK pays (say Greece, but put any other EU member state in its place) more than the said country pays the UK. As some Peer lady gently pointed out in the House of Lords recently - hands up anyone who knows of a Spaniard, who has retired to live in the UK? Or a Greek. Or a Portuguese! So much reporting is done with insufficient research. Only half a story is dangerous.

Given that the payments by the various EU members that we are talking about are for PENSIONERS only, it's hardly surprising that the UK is paying more than it receives from other EU states! And, it's still a helluva lot cheaper than it would be to treat us all in the UK! Bob.
Yesterday today was tomorrow. Don't dilly dally!

Keltz
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Re: Withdrawal Agreement and Our Rights

Postby Keltz » Fri Jan 10, 2020 11:51 am

bobscott wrote:Already France has made some kind of 'arrangement' with the UK, or at least a 'proposal' to the UK, independent of the EU. Am still hopeful.


I guess there is a reason why nothing has been signed off by EU countries yet, not least now the WA has been agreed and was followed by a Tweet from Deborah Meaden"Very uncomfortable about lack of interest, debate, and amount of failed promises on the Brexit Withdrawl Bill passes today.Is this how we are going to be now? Sheep?"

Also followed by this article titled "With his majority in place, Johnson chips away at EU citizen's rights "
https://www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2020/0 ... eu-citizen

I think the EU know what is ahead for them with Julie Owen Moylan tweeting a couple days ago "Without the free movement of people, you cannot have the free movement of goods and services".

It does look like we are in for a long year of being a political football.

Kilkis
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Re: Withdrawal Agreement and Our Rights

Postby Kilkis » Fri Jan 10, 2020 1:58 pm

The country had ample proof that Johnson is a serial liar with no moral compass. They voted him in to power with a massive majority so he can do exactly what he wants. It is no great surprise that he is exercising that power to the full. I think the most important test will be how he reshuffles his cabinet in February. Will he get rid of the hawks like Rees-Mogg and Priti Patel or will he keep them.

Warwick

Carolina
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Re: Withdrawal Agreement and Our Rights

Postby Carolina » Fri Jan 17, 2020 4:16 pm

Latest posts have been split to the 'Alternatve thread' topic.

Our rights are pretty important and this Withdrawal Agreement thread should stay on topic.

Thanks,
Carol, Admin.

Kilkis
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Re: Withdrawal Agreement and Our Rights

Postby Kilkis » Fri Jan 17, 2020 6:49 pm

There was a debate in the EU Parliament on Wednesday about the Withdrawal Agreement and especially citizens rights. There is a summary in this EU Parliament News article. The article contains links to various bits of the debate. The final paragraph of the article reads, my emphasis in red:

    Part Two of the Withdrawal Agreement protects EU citizens in the UK and UK citizens in other EU countries, as well as their families. According to its provisions, all social security rights under EU law will be maintained and citizens’ rights will be guaranteed throughout their lifetime. All relevant administrative procedures have to be transparent, smooth and streamlined. The implementation and application of these terms will be overseen by an independent authority with powers equivalent to those of the European Commission.

The paragraph states ALL social security rights so that would include healthcare but it is pretty clear that the EU does not trust the UK government to honour the agreement in full.

Warwick

altohb
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S1 holders update

Postby altohb » Wed Jan 22, 2020 5:10 pm

From the British Embassy in Greece facebook page (Brits in Greece).

"We’ve had some questions from UK state pensioners (S1 form holders) about how their healthcare cover will be affected after we leave the EU. Here’s what you (and any S1 dependants) need to know about the future of your healthcare cover:

S1 form holders who have moved to Greece before 31st December 2020 will continue to have life-long healthcare rights provided they remain registered as resident in Greece.

This means access to healthcare in Greece will not change for those S1 form holders for as long as they remain resident in Greece.

Remember that as an S1 form holder, if you visit the UK you will still be able to access free NHS care when temporarily visiting England, Scotland and Wales, as you can now."

Some comfort there. Clarity needed for those of us who won't get SP in our own right before the cut off date - suggestion is to call the pension service about that.


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