If you are fully vaccianted in Greece...

For discussion, news, comments, questions and information about Crete & Greece.
bobscott
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Location: Kokkino Horio

Re: If you are fully vaccianted in Greece...

Postby bobscott » Fri Nov 12, 2021 6:55 pm

Some peoplle prefer to read, believe and quote blatantly biased news. Others prefer to take a different view from different sources. Only inside oneself can one determine which is rubbish and which is true. Each to his own. Live and let die (oops, sorry) live. Bob
Yesterday today was tomorrow. Don't dilly dally!

Yorgo
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Joined: Sat May 05, 2018 10:16 pm

Re: If you are fully vaccianted in Greece...

Postby Yorgo » Fri Nov 12, 2021 8:26 pm

30,000 runners registered to take part in the Marathon this weekend in Athens. ??

Yorgo
Posts: 76
Joined: Sat May 05, 2018 10:16 pm

Re: If you are fully vaccianted in Greece...

Postby Yorgo » Sat Nov 13, 2021 9:28 am

Oh well. It shocks me none of you can have a decent conversation. OK, many people want the vaccines - thats fine. Many millions do not, for me thats also fine. But why the abstract, side-swipes? "Anti -Vaxxer BRIGADE"? "Children get their facts" - "Live and let die" ??
It underpins an attitude ones ideological stance is challenged. What is so touchy you cite statistics with a side-swipe comment instead of mature discourse?
I support100% ones right to choose to have the vaccines and take the tests and wear a mask etc. I have simply pointed out the real life human impact on behaviour. I do not have a problem.

Statistics as to xxx died and Pfiezer is best etc have no bearing at all upon the actual, real life governance of people as they live their lives.
If I say: NHS staff are angels and wonderful hero's LETS ALL DANCE AND CLAP IN THE STREETS AT 7 PM (EVEN BORIS JOHNSON INSISTED ON THIS) Multi millions did just that. Never mind they had no employment but the nurses, NHS staff were working. Move forward to this week - NHS staff in their hundreds of thousands - SACKED!! Forced to leave their job because of vaccine mandates. Lost everything - wages, pensions etc.
This Sunday we have Remembrance Day - in recognition of the millions who died, forfeited their lives for freedom. Oooh the irony!!
Statistics do not deal with the real life imposition of mandates and "laws' when imposed in double-standard way having nothing to do with wether a virus is a KILLER or not.

One should not be offended because of comments that differ to their own.
Remember the farmer who every morning goes to the Hen House to feed the hens, the Sun is rising, all is fine. Then one morning he goes to the Hen House, the Sun is rising, Rings the necks of the Hens for the dinner tables.

In England the Diwali - Hindu/Sikh festival Of Light has been celebrated by the biggest turn out of people ever, in the streets. Yet the government is preparing and some towns/cities have already put in place rules to stop people celebrating Christmas.

There is a Veteran in England turned away from his local Legion who said; "If you have to show your papers to attend the Remembrance Parades - you've already forgotten".

Kilkis
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Location: Near Chania

Re: If you are fully vaccianted in Greece...

Postby Kilkis » Sat Nov 13, 2021 10:07 am

The problem, Yorgo, is that there are no rights without responsibility. You want the right to do whatever you want but that right is reliant on you taking the responsibility to not do anything that could adversely affect someone else.

If the virus is allowed to spread a lot of people will die. In my age group, i.e. 75, males have around an 11 % chance of dying if they catch COVID and about half that for females and eventually everybody will catch it if we do nothing. For older people it is higher and for younger people it is lower. If the spread of the virus is allowed to accelerate even more people will die because the healthcare system becomes overwhelmed and people go untreated. We all have the responsibility to take whatever steps we can to stop that happening. We can't stop the spread but we can reduce it. No single step will do the job.

Vaccination has the biggest single effect in reducing spread short of total isolation. It is free to the individual and very low cost to the healthcare system, i.e. the tax payer. It is easy to distribute, at least in developed countries. It is extremely safe compared with the disease it helps to prevent.

Wearing a mask only works if everybody wears one at all times in crowded spaces, especially indoors. If people simply decide for themselves whether to wear one or not and a large percentage choose not to it becomes useless as a measure to reduce spread. It is extremely low cost to the individual, has no impact on the overall economy and is a minor inconvenience.

When you say you want the right to decide whether to take the vaccine or whether to wear a mask you are saying you are not prepared to take your responsibility to reduce the spread of the virus. It is the cult of "I". It is why in all countries people who do take their responsibilities seriously have contempt for those who don't. The worst are those that try to convince others that they shouldn't either.

Warwick

mouche
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Joined: Sat Jan 15, 2011 5:43 pm

Re: If you are fully vaccianted in Greece...

Postby mouche » Sat Nov 13, 2021 2:01 pm

Kilkis wrote:The problem, Yorgo, is that there are no rights without responsibility. You want the right to do whatever you want but that right is reliant on you taking the responsibility to not do anything that could adversely affect someone else.
Warwick


Amen!

bobscott
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Joined: Wed Aug 05, 2009 5:36 pm
Location: Kokkino Horio

Re: If you are fully vaccianted in Greece...

Postby bobscott » Sat Nov 13, 2021 2:56 pm

mouche wrote:
Kilkis wrote:The problem, Yorgo, is that there are no rights without responsibility. You want the right to do whatever you want but that right is reliant on you taking the responsibility to not do anything that could adversely affect someone else.
Warwick


Amen!


HR = Human Resources, Human Rights, Human Responsibiities - er, eh, what? :D
Yesterday today was tomorrow. Don't dilly dally!

evansmr1
Posts: 394
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2010 3:00 pm
Location: Pirgos, Kalo Horio,

Re: If you are fully vaccianted in Greece...

Postby evansmr1 » Thu Nov 25, 2021 11:32 am

We had our 3rd covid vaccine on Monday (22/11). Today I decided that we should download the new EU Digital Covid-19 Certificate.
However, no luck I have tried all the methods that I had previously noted. The nearest that I can get is one that also requires our travel documents. But we are not currently travelling anywhere. Downloading the documents that confirms we have had the 3 Jabs Vaccination Record Certificate is possible, but it is not the same as the so called "Passport"

Wise people please advise (Warwick)

Thanks
Mike
=============
Sic parvis magna

bobscott
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Location: Kokkino Horio

Re: If you are fully vaccianted in Greece...

Postby bobscott » Thu Nov 25, 2021 1:12 pm

evansmr1 wrote:We had our 3rd covid vaccine on Monday (22/11). Today I decided that we should download the new EU Digital Covid-19 Certificate.
However, no luck I have tried all the methods that I had previously noted. The nearest that I can get is one that also requires our travel documents. But we are not currently travelling anywhere. Downloading the documents that confirms we have had the 3 Jabs Vaccination Record Certificate is possible, but it is not the same as the so called "Passport"

Wise people please advise (Warwick)

Thanks


Sounds like you are using the wrong link. Try this one, in Google Chrome to get the English version. It will give you the EU certiiicate if you click on the first blue button. Bob. https://www.gov.gr/ipiresies/ugeia-kai- ... ertificate
Yesterday today was tomorrow. Don't dilly dally!

Kilkis
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Location: Near Chania

Re: If you are fully vaccianted in Greece...

Postby Kilkis » Thu Nov 25, 2021 1:17 pm

They are not asking for travel documents in the sense of boarding passes. They are asking you to fill in what identity document you will use when you travel, i.e. your passport or your ID card. I always select passport and put my passport number. It usually then says it cannot identify you but it shows your name and date of birth and asks you to confirm that they are the same as on your travel document. If you confirm it will provide the EU COVID Passport.

I suspect that the Emvolio web site is mainly using your AMKA records even though you use Taxisnet ID and Password to enter. When you got your AMKA issued by KEP they recorded your passport number. It is quite likely that, if you have lived here for some time, you will have renewed your passport since then but not informed AMKA. Hence what you enter to get the certificate and what they have recorded don't match. I don't know this for sure. When you renew a passport here are some of the organisations that you should inform and provide a photocopy of the new one:

    1 The tax office. You will need to fill in a new M1 form.
    2 Your bank(s).
    3 AMKA probably through KEP.
    4 EFKA, formerly IKA, if you have it through an S1 form. You could do that at your annual renewal in February.
    5 Cosmote if you have a landline/broadband contract.
    6 Your mobile service provider.
There are probably others and some might also want a photocopy of your new biometric residence card.

Warwick

Joan
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Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2014 10:16 am
Location: Sussex and Crete

Re: If you are fully vaccianted in Greece...

Postby Joan » Thu Nov 25, 2021 1:39 pm

Don't expect this to happen in a hurry...

Realising my AMKA records contain my old passport details, I tried to update (via KEP).

They gave me a form but said that my tax number needed the update first. Our accountant confirmed this. He put in the information for us in June. It has not been actioned - we are told that the tax system is in chaos and passport changes are low priority.

Joan

evansmr1
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Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2010 3:00 pm
Location: Pirgos, Kalo Horio,

Re: If you are fully vaccianted in Greece...

Postby evansmr1 » Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:02 pm

Thank you Bobscott for your reply

That is the Link that I used. I have tried it again and it did not work, would not accept that I was not going to travel. Tried again for the 5th time and BINGO it worked.

Warwick, also thanks. You may have hit the nail on the head as a Friend of mine is having real problems. I will pass on your advise to him. I rather suspect that it may be a Passport issue. I seemed to recall that when renewing my Health Book 9 years ago they asked for my new passport, which had just been received as the previous one had obviously expired.

I must remember your advise for later this year when my Passport will again be renewed.

We should all be aware of this problem.
Mike
=============
Sic parvis magna

Kilkis
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Location: Near Chania

Re: If you are fully vaccianted in Greece...

Postby Kilkis » Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:29 pm

It can certainly cause problems when the information held by the tax office and the information held by AMKA don't agree. When I tried to register some friends for e-prescriptions, which was the initial route to vaccination appointments, his worked and hers didn't. In the end it transpired that AMKA had the spelling of her name wrong. KEP corrected that for her. When I tried to make appointments for us all to renew our EFKA his wouldn't work because of a difficulty with his father's name. I managed to get round that one.

Warwick

chrissyg
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Re: If you are fully vaccianted in Greece...

Postby chrissyg » Thu Nov 25, 2021 6:22 pm

[quote="Yorgo"]

In England the Diwali - Hindu/Sikh festival Of Light has been celebrated by the biggest turn out of people ever, in the streets. Yet the government is preparing and some towns/cities have already put in place rules to stop people celebrating Christmas..

Yorgo, my uncle died of covid in the first wave. He was old but if he had had the jab then he would have done and would probably have survived.
The jabs have undoubtedy saved a lot of lives, but i agree it should be personal choice. You say it is freedom to choose not to but because of your choice and all the other people not taking it, we still have people dying and more covid spreading, which is going to lead to less freedom again. It is going to go on and on.
I for one am willingly taking a small risk, as i do when i take the majority of medicines i have taken in my life, in order to save myself from dying and help the spread of this disease but also because the freedoms taken away from me during lockdown, like not being able to see or hug my children , were awful and i dont want it to go there again. The only way to ever bring life back to normal again is by the vast majority having the vaccine or a cure.

Kilkis
Posts: 13080
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 3:58 pm
Location: Near Chania

Re: If you are fully vaccianted in Greece...

Postby Kilkis » Thu Nov 25, 2021 11:47 pm

You are completely correct, Yorgo. You have an absolute right to refuse to take the vaccine. Similarly the rest of society has an absolute right to refuse to allow you to mingle with us because you haven't taken the vaccine. By all means don't take the vaccine but don't complain when that results in your rights to do other things being restricted.

You won't take the vaccine because you don't believe it is safe. Those of us who do take the vaccine don't want you anywhere near us because we believe you are less safe than somebody who has. You don't agree with our beliefs and we don't agree with yours. It doesn't matter who is right. Many more people have opted to take the vaccine than have refused and a general principle of a democracy is that the will of the majority prevails.

I was against Brexit and said so on this forum. The UK voted 52% to 48% to leave. Despite my views I completely accepted that vote. In Greece 63% of the population have accepted the vaccine, 4% are part way through the process and and 33% have refused so far, although some of that 33% may not be eligible. That is a much bigger majority for vaccination so you need to simply accept what that majority decides in terms of restrictions on your life.

Warwick

bobscott
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Re: If you are fully vaccianted in Greece...

Postby bobscott » Fri Nov 26, 2021 10:16 am

Since Monday 22nd Nov it has for the first time been stated by the Greek Government that entrance to a church will require a check on vaccination status and identity just like going into tavernas and shops. The Greek Orthodox have already said that the plan is unworkable because they just can't do it and have told the Government just that. Does anyone know if the rule has been relaxed yet? Bob
Yesterday today was tomorrow. Don't dilly dally!


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