IKA & Marriage

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Yin&Yang
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IKA & Marriage

Postby Yin&Yang » Thu Feb 02, 2017 3:46 pm

Hello, my partner and I have lived here for 4 years. He is retired and has an IKA book. I am not of retirement age and my own book expired after the allotted two year period. Accepted that this may all change due to last year's referendum and putting that to one side for the moment, if we were to marry, would I be eligible for IKA?

I have contacted the DWP in the UK but they say it is up to Greece whether to accept me or not. I cannot find any further information via IKA's website and shall contact them should no one here have any experience of this.

Thanks.
Someday is now : )

Kilkis
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Re: IKA & Marriage

Postby Kilkis » Thu Feb 02, 2017 5:27 pm

Certainly for UK citizens who are already married and one spouse gets issued with an S1 form by DWP when they qualify for a UK State Pension they can get the other spouse added as a dependent. I am not sure how it works if someone gets married after the S1 form has been issued. I would guess they would need to ask DWP to issue a new S1 form with the spouse on it. Also I am not sure what happens if the dependent spouse is not a UK citizen.

Warwick

PS Just in case you weren't aware the S1 Form is what you take to IKA to get a health book issued.

Yin&Yang
Posts: 240
Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 6:03 pm
Location: Megala Horafia/Aptera

Re: IKA & Marriage

Postby Yin&Yang » Thu Feb 02, 2017 6:35 pm

Thank you Kilkis. I used the S1 form when I arrived to get my IKA book and which has now expired. The DWP don't seem to have a facility to help me further now that I am here. I am English by the way. We shall visit a KEP office next week to ask their advice but thank you for enlightening me with what you know. Should I find out more, I shall post it here in case it ever affects anyone else.
Someday is now : )

Kilkis
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Re: IKA & Marriage

Postby Kilkis » Thu Feb 02, 2017 7:02 pm

I don't think IKA or KEP will be able to help you. IKA only issue health books to employees who contribute to IKA and people who have an S1 form that means IKA can reclaim health costs from another country. In the latter case they will only issue a book to people who are named on the S1 form. KEP only knows Greek rules and procedures.

The S1 form replaced a number of forms that were used previously for different situations, e.g. E106/E121. Early retirees could get one for a limited period depending on their NI contribution record and I would guess that is what you had that gave you cover for 2 years. That has now been stopped. Now DWP only issue an S1 form to people who are receiving a UK State Pension. They will include on the S1 form a dependent spouse but I suspect not an unmarried dependent partner. Only DWP can tell you if your partner, who already has an S1 form, can get a new form issued with your name on it as a dependent spouse if you get married. Your partner, not you, needs to contact the DWP Overseas Healthcare Team and ask them the specific question, "If you get married will they issue him with a new S1 form with your name on it as a dependent spouse?"

Warwick

Yin&Yang
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Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 6:03 pm
Location: Megala Horafia/Aptera

Re: IKA & Marriage

Postby Yin&Yang » Fri Feb 03, 2017 8:01 am

Again, very many thanks, especially for the time you have taken to give a clear reply. I'll admit to not being able to see the wood for the trees on this. My partner will, as you suggest, contact the DWP Overseas Healthcare Team and I'll keep the forum up to date.
Someday is now : )

susieQ
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Re: IKA & Marriage

Postby susieQ » Fri Feb 03, 2017 12:34 pm

I am in a similar situation to Yin&Yang in that my partner and I are not married and he has an IKA book as a UK pensioner, which he obtained with the S1 form issued by DWP in Newcastle. I am not of retirement age, but last July I was able to obtain an IKA book as my partner's dependent, due to a new law passed in Greece around April 2016 which says as an EU member, Greece has to acknowledge partners. In order to obtain the IKA book for me, we had to go to a notary to have a "Cohabitation agreement" drawn up, saying we lived together and that my partner financially supported me (this cost 80 euros). We then took this, and a photocopy of the agreement for IKA to keep, along with the usual passport, photos, residence permit etc and they gave me an IKA health insurance book. I did not have to submit an S1 form. Our notary told us that since this new law was passed, IKA have to acknowledge cohabiting partners and issue a book to both parties as if you are married. It certainly worked for me!
susieQ

Kilkis
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Re: IKA & Marriage

Postby Kilkis » Fri Feb 03, 2017 1:33 pm

Sounds like good news for unmarried partners, SusieQ. It also illustrates how the law is constantly changing so it is difficult to give advice based on past experience.

It does surprise me that they would do this. I can understand having a law forcing organisations to treat unmarried partners in the same way that they treat married couples but it does create an anomaly in this case. Basically Greece is not really responsible for your healthcare since Greece only accepts responsibility for people who pay into its insurance system. For UK State Pensioners the UK accepts responsibility for their healthcare but not for anybody else. For that group, according to the EU rules, Greece provides the treatment but bills the UK for the cost and the S1 form is the method for the UK to acknowledge their responsibility to pay. In your case Greece will provide the treatment, because they have issued you with a health book, but I am not sure if the UK will accept a bill for the cost, since they have never issued an S1 with your name on it. Very strange.

Warwick

YoMo2
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Re: IKA & Marriage

Postby YoMo2 » Fri Feb 03, 2017 3:54 pm

Maybe Greece will take responsibility for SusieQ's healthcare? As they are behaving so magnanimously in acknowledging her status as a partner to a pensioner......

Andrew
"It's all in the implementation"

Yin&Yang
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Location: Megala Horafia/Aptera

Re: IKA & Marriage

Postby Yin&Yang » Fri Feb 03, 2017 4:34 pm

Excellent news and amazing that your situation mirrors my own SusieQ! I have arranged to meet our Notary next week :D
Someday is now : )

Yin&Yang
Posts: 240
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Location: Megala Horafia/Aptera

Re: IKA & Marriage

Postby Yin&Yang » Thu Mar 16, 2017 5:54 pm

UPDATE: I appreciate that things change but thought I'd post today's experience for anyone who may find this of interest or use.

Today we visited our Notary in Chania and signed our Cohabitation Agreement. Prior to that, upon contacting our Notary last month in this regard, she sent us a template/draft of an Agreement in Greek. We have conversational Greek but this was legal jargon and so we had it translated by our teacher of the Greek language. From this template we were then able to decide which elements we wished to have included and excluded in our tailor-made Agreement. For example; because of our ages and the fact that we have lived together for 17 years, we knew we would not be having any children together and thus minimised that particular clause by saying that any issue would take my partner's surname (the clause could not legally be excluded), also I did not wish to take my partners' surname and so that was stipulated, all of our property is in our joint names and covered by our Wills and so reference to the detail of this was excluded in our Agreement. The cost to us was 120 Euros and in addition to that we paid for four copies at 10 Euros each. The original document is kept at the Notary's office (she also has our Will, so it's nice and tidy), the four copies we have are stamped and signed copies.

Living within the Chania District, we now have to take one of the documents to the Municipality of Chania offices (close to the Bus Depot) to have the Agreement registered. They keep that copy. Unfortunately by the time we'd finished at the Notary's office the MofC offices had closed (opening hours we are advised as between 9am - 1pm).

We can then visit IKA in order to obtain an IKA book for myself. I arrived in Crete with an S1 form (not technically correct because I was 52 when we arrived in Crete so it was an S-something form, where I had an IKA book which lasted for two years). My book expired because my partner and I are not married and I could therefore not be added onto his book. Hence going down the Cohabitation Agreement route.

Again for the record, the Cohabitation Agreement is a legally binding document and we had to declare that we were not otherwise related, by adoption or birth, were not married to others nor had a Cohabitation Agreement with anyone else. To dissolve the Agreement we would have to return to the Notary and declare our intentions, she would then draw up a document to this end and we would then have to take that to the Municipality of Chania offices to have that registered.

Interestingly, should we ever decide to become Husband and Wife, we would have to have our Cohabitation Agreement dissolved first (see above paragraph).
Someday is now : )

Kilkis
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Re: IKA & Marriage

Postby Kilkis » Thu Mar 16, 2017 8:16 pm

Yin&Yang wrote:...I arrived in Crete with an S1 form (not technically correct because I was 52 when we arrived in Crete so it was an S-something form, where I had an IKA book which lasted for two years)...


I think it would have been an S1 form. Before S1 there were three main forms, E106, E109 and E121. They covered different circumstances. For example E121 covered state pensioners and one of E106/E109, not sure which, covered people for a short period if they retired and moved abroad before reaching state pension age. I think the other covered people who moved abroad to seek work. How long the latter two lasted depended on when during the year you applied and your NI contribution record. I think those numbers are still used for EEA countries but they were replaced by the single S1 within the EU. I think S1 now only applies to state pensioners.

Warwick

Carolina
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Re: IKA & Marriage

Postby Carolina » Fri Mar 17, 2017 2:58 pm

Yin&Yang wrote:
Again for the record, the Cohabitation Agreement is a legally binding document


Just a thought, if you do your tax returns in Greece do you now have to do a joint one, as married couples in Greece do?

Yin&Yang
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Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 6:03 pm
Location: Megala Horafia/Aptera

Re: IKA & Marriage

Postby Yin&Yang » Sat Mar 18, 2017 7:17 am

Good point and I shall ask George our Accountant.
Someday is now : )

Yin&Yang
Posts: 240
Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 6:03 pm
Location: Megala Horafia/Aptera

Re: IKA & Marriage

Postby Yin&Yang » Tue Mar 21, 2017 6:08 pm

For Information:
We visited the Municipality of Chania this morning only to discover that our village still comes under Souda so we did an about turn and visited the Court House in Souda, didn't have to wait and our CA was registered. There was no fee involved and we were given several copies plus the original of the Registration document. The Registrar kept one of the stamped copies of our CA for his file. Supporting documentation required was our passports although we were also asked for our Amka number so we were pleased that we took along other documentation so as not to hold anything up.
Someday is now : )

Yin&Yang
Posts: 240
Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 6:03 pm
Location: Megala Horafia/Aptera

Re: IKA & Marriage

Postby Yin&Yang » Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:36 am

Regarding tax returns now that we have a Cohabitation Agreement, we are advised that as with a married couple, we do have the option to submit a joint tax return but can likewise choose to carry on submitting individual returns.

We're off to IKA today so I will post an update later.

I realise that this thread has a limited audience because our Registrar told us, he has only registered three Agreements so far, ours being one of them.
Someday is now : )


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