Eastern Crete

For discussion, news, comments, questions and information about Crete & Greece.
Maud
Posts: 573
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 10:46 pm
Location: S.W. England/ S.W. Crete.

Re: Eastern Crete

Postby Maud » Tue Jan 01, 2019 6:51 pm

Sadly poisoning and beating does happen, but things are improving. It is also true that not all Cretans treat their dogs badly. Our friends have ‘working dogs’ for the sheep, but although they live outdoors, they are treated well......and are every bit as well looked after as ‘working dogs’ in the U.K. - I would even say better looked after than farm dogs in some cases. They are also mourned when they die, just as a pet dog would be.

Attitudes are changing in Greece as a whole, but parts of Crete are certainly ‘leading the field’ with the change. This must be encouraged......and good examples set.

Back on topic.......

Amanda is living in Spain just now, and there are problems there with ‘animal care’ as well, so I am sure it won’t put her off moving to Crete. I thought Old Codger’s post about supermarkets etc was most useful, as was Moved 2 Crete’s post about Darmarochori. I know Kolymbari has that huge newish hotel now, but it is still a nice area to live in, and not that far from Chania, especially since the ‘new road’ has been extended. (I am showing my age now!).

Do explore the island, and rent for a while if you can Amanda. Unless you have spend time in different parts of it you will not experience how diverse it is.

filippos
Posts: 5673
Joined: Mon Feb 05, 2007 7:38 pm
Location: Kalyves
Contact:

Re: Eastern Crete

Postby filippos » Tue Jan 01, 2019 7:38 pm

Maud wrote:....I know Kolymbari has that huge newish hotel now, but it is still a nice area to live in, and not that far from Chania, .........
I've been told by friends who live close to Kolymbari that another even bigger hotel is scheduled. I've not been in touch with them for a few months but It's possible that construction may have begun. The friends loathe the idea.

Daisy
Posts: 132
Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2012 10:12 am
Location: Greece

Re: Eastern Crete

Postby Daisy » Wed Jan 02, 2019 11:06 am

We live in a small village on the north east coast. There are one other British couple here full time and one English lady who visits for a few weeks each summer. The local villagers have been extremely warm and welcoming. They have become dependable friends.
It takes about 40 mins to drive into Aghios Nicholas and about 30mins to drive into Sitia. Both of these drives are along what I consider to be, on the whole, the most beautiful road in the world, so it is not a chore.
Heraklion, is about 1 hour away.
I have had to use, both the ambulance service and hospital stays twice and had very good treatment both times.
There is one shop in the village, one kafenion, one taverna and just a few minutes away in the neighbouring village, there are more tavernas, a pharmakeio, a hairdressers,a bakers, more shops and small businesses such as metalworkers, woodworkers etc.
Yes, the western part of Crete, is greener, but we can always park when shopping in Sitia, even in the height of summer and my own little garden is green year round just by hand watering once a fortnight.

Imagemay 2018 185 - Copy by Daisyincrete, on Flickr

Image. by Daisyincrete, on Flickr

...and a couple of views of the eastern end.

Image. by Daisyincrete, on Flickr

Image. by Daisyincrete, on Flickr

Daisy

moved 2 crete
Posts: 790
Joined: Mon Mar 15, 2010 1:37 pm
Location: Kolimbari, Chania

Re: Eastern Crete

Postby moved 2 crete » Wed Jan 02, 2019 12:11 pm

Whatever part of Crete you choose to live in, be prepared for the rainy season, I just hope Daisy that your beautiful garden survived the torrential rain of yesterday, our lane became a raging river carrying all before it, 3 years ago the same type of rainstorm took the end of our cul-de-sac we lost about 4 meters of the land leaving a small shed overhanging a 20 foot drop, as long as you find a well- built property you should have liltle trouble.
Dave H

Kilkis
Posts: 10385
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 3:58 pm
Location: Near Chania

Re: Eastern Crete

Postby Kilkis » Wed Jan 02, 2019 12:21 pm

filippos wrote:...I've been told by friends who live close to Kolymbari that another even bigger hotel is scheduled. I've not been in touch with them for a few months but It's possible that construction may have begun. The friends loathe the idea.


I can never really understand the antipathy to hotels being built? I would guess that virtually all of us who now live here first came on holiday and stayed in an hotel, apartment or villa. How would we ever have come if such places didn't exist? We all now live in a house or apartment. Before that home was built it was just land. We have all destroyed part of the natural landscape of Crete one way or another. Every human being everywhere on earth who lives in a property has destroyed part of their local landscape.

I have friends who, for a time, lived in an apartment on the hillside above the Avra Imperial in Kolymbari, the existing big posh hotel. Sitting on their terrace you looked down on it from a distance of a few 100 m. It didn't really impact on their life in any way. Sure it was part of their view but so were houses, apartments, shops, cafés, tavernas, a bank, the beach, the sea and the countryside. With prices ranging from €250 to €1,200 per night I doubt if they are taking much trade away from the sort of local hotel that I tended to use.

I can understand why people object to hotels being built in areas where it is going to have a major impact on the natural habitat for wildlife and there are plenty of places that it could be built without doing damage. I can understand if somebody wouldn't want a big hotel built right next door to them. Other than that I don't see the problem. Crete needs tourism.

Warwick

Maud
Posts: 573
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 10:46 pm
Location: S.W. England/ S.W. Crete.

Re: Eastern Crete

Postby Maud » Wed Jan 02, 2019 3:10 pm

My guess is Kilkis that often a large hotel can change the character of a village. Kolymbari used to be a quiet fishing village.....like Elounda! We stayed in Hotel Dimitra there many years ago. I think it has eight rooms! We liked the village so much we found an apartment to rent and stayed another week.

Last time we went to the village it was very busy. We were actually visiting friends in Kalydonia, and even though my friend is Greek, and can see the benefits of increased tourism, she was not happy about the size of the new huge hotel. - Many of the locals take a very sensible ‘balanced’ approach to ‘economy’over ‘quality of life.’

Some of the huge hotels outside of Rethymno have been built well away from local towns and villages. They provide for all the needs the tourists are looking for. I agree that they money does not go in to the pockets of the locals, as this type of tourism only benefits the hotel owners, but it also enables small villages to maintain their unique atmosphere.

I can understand why Phil’s friends are concerned about a second large hotel in Kolymbari. By all means build huge hotels, but choose the situation well. It is not just about the view, but also the character of an area.

Kilkis
Posts: 10385
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 3:58 pm
Location: Near Chania

Re: Eastern Crete

Postby Kilkis » Wed Jan 02, 2019 4:21 pm

I'm not sure what you mean by "the quiet fishing Village", Maud? Kolymbari isn't really like a single village at all. There is a single road about 700 m long running from the harbour to the square with a bust and then along the beach road which is largely cafés and tavernas on the beach side and houses and small shops on the opposite side. Another road about 1 km long branches off that and goes to the town hall and another inland grouping of houses. A third road goes from the square to the old national road where there is another grouping of houses, shops, cafés, tavernas and a bank. The Avra Imperial has been built on either side of this third road close to this third grouping. It is built where there were previously fields and it stretches down to the beach but at the far end of the previous development on the beach road. It doesn't really impinge on or change the character at all of the area close to the harbour and running along the beach road nor the area near the town hall. The area it is closest to was a commercial area before it was built and not at all like a quiet fishing village. In other words, Kolymbari had developed and spread long before the Avra Imperial was even thought of.

I don't know anywhere that doesn't change. At what point in time should everything be frozen? One hundred years ago the UK had a population of 40 million and now it is 65 million, i.e. a 60 % increase. You cannot increase the population by 60 % and expect everything to stay the same. I don't have figures for Greece but I would guess the trend is similar. I doubt if one or two large hotels make very much difference in the broader scheme of things. I have no wish to stay in one and so I couldn't care less whether they exist or not but plenty of people do.

Warwick

peebee
Posts: 787
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2011 5:07 am
Location: Kalyves

Re: Eastern Crete

Postby peebee » Wed Jan 02, 2019 5:02 pm

Kilkis wrote: I don't have figures for Greece but I would guess the trend is similar.

Warwick

The population of Greece has increased from approx 10.1 million to 11.1 million since 1988.
It was 7.7 million in 1950, so about 44% in 68 years.

Maud
Posts: 573
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 10:46 pm
Location: S.W. England/ S.W. Crete.

Re: Eastern Crete

Postby Maud » Wed Jan 02, 2019 7:04 pm

The population of Greece is starting to decline Peebee.
http://www.ekathimerini.com/233090/arti ... king-aging

As for Kolymbari being a fishing village Kilkis, it certainly was....plus a gateway to the Rodopos. We’ve sat in our friend’s parents house.....where the goat lived under the main room....cracking maggot ridden walnuts from their trees in the garden. - The old man made his living from the sea. As I mentioned previously, Elounda was the same.....and although still an attractive location, it is filled with coaches full of tourists and tripper boats now.

It is interesting that you don’t see Kolymbari as somewhere that was ever a village Kilkis. I am sure there are still many locals there that remember it as such. We certainly recall just a couple of tavernas on the left hand side of the road as you head north. There was one touristy gift shop on the right, and the area around the harbour was totally undeveloped. (No tavernas there then....just a cafenion for the fishermen). There has always been some commercial facilities for the locals of the whole area, but that didn’t prevent Kolymbari still being a fishing village.

I am not sure when you moved to Crete ‘Moved 2 Crete’ You mention buying your house from Minoan Homes.The family that owns the company has quite a bit of land on the Rodopos. They have been instrumental in building new homes in the Kolymbari area, but have been careful not to over develop such an attractive part of Crete. As I said earlier, many locals are very aware of keeping the the good things about such a beautiful island. I am not against progress, but I don’t want to see things changed beyond recognition just for financial gain.

Thank you for the beautiful photos of your garden once again by the way Daisy.

toastie
Posts: 66
Joined: Mon Mar 13, 2017 3:57 pm

Re: Eastern Crete

Postby toastie » Wed Jan 02, 2019 9:23 pm

I actually agree with people that say dogs in the Apokoronas are not looked after well.
Every night I have to listen to a yapping dog until late because the so called owners don't give a toss about the thing.
Its tied to a tree on a 6 foot lead and constantly yaps at everything that moves until i guess it runs out a breath and falls asleep.

Kilkis
Posts: 10385
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 3:58 pm
Location: Near Chania

Re: Eastern Crete

Postby Kilkis » Wed Jan 02, 2019 11:56 pm

I'm not saying Kolymbari was never a small fishing village, Maud. I am saying it changed to being a sprawl of a tourist village many many years before the Avra Imperial was built in 2011. Have a look at it on Google Earth. The Avra Imperial is now the biggest single feature and dominates the area. Now cover that up. Everything else that you see was all there before the Avra Imperial was built. Does that look like the small fishing village you remember? Tourism changed Kolymbari not the Avra Imperial. Greek owned shops, tavernas, cafés and small hotels grew up to serve an ever increasing tourist trade. If there is a demand a market will grow up to serve that demand and largely it will grow from something that is already there.

If there had not been tourism on Crete almost 40 years ago I would never have visited it and then I would never have come here to live. I suspect that applies to most people on this forum. I accept that not everybody wants what I wanted as a tourist, i.e. basically somewhere to sleep close to lots of tavernas so I can eat in a different one every night. Some people want a five star experience and I for one cannot condemn that. Nostalgia ain't what it used to be, Maud. Once where your friends lived was a piece of virgin land. They built a house on it and destroyed that virgin land. Why was them doing that a good thing and somebody else doing the same thing later on a nearby piece of land bad? When was the village an optimum size? One house, ten houses, one hundred houses etc and who decides?

Warwick

Maud
Posts: 573
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 10:46 pm
Location: S.W. England/ S.W. Crete.

Re: Eastern Crete

Postby Maud » Thu Jan 03, 2019 12:44 am

I feel you have lost the original reason for my post here Kilkis. If you read my comment at the top of this page, (sorry, I am not good at copying anything in!), I mentioned that Kolymbari is still a nice place to live, - despite the large hotel!

I accept that places change over time, and I do not need to look at Google Earth, - I have visited Kolymbari a number of times since the construction of the Avra Imperial. I was just commenting on Phil’s post, - when he said that his friends who live near Kolymbari are not happy with the thought of yet another large hotel.

Some of us choose quiet, unspoilt places to live, like your own village. (We have done as much in both the U.K. and Crete). I am sure that those of us who seek out such places would not be happy if someone then built a huge hotel in our village!

It has been a long time since Kolymbari has been a small fishing community. I fail to see however your comparison between previous generations of Greeks building a family house to live in, (whilst they earned a living from fishing), with the development of the Avra Imperial Hotel. My friend’s parents home is a very old, (quite dilapidated), stone built house.......and is ‘generations’ old! It is a ‘proper’ old Greek home, where the animals lived with the humans! The area would probably have started as a hamlet, then developed in to a village, but I think most of us can distinguish between a small village, and what a large hotel can do to any community. I agree, Kolymbari is no longer a small fishing village.....but it was at one time.....which was all I was saying! I was not being nostalgic......just stating a fact!

Sorry Amanda, we have gone a bit ‘off topic’ here, but the moral is that you need to be careful where you buy if you are truly looking for a quiet, rural lifestyle.

filippos
Posts: 5673
Joined: Mon Feb 05, 2007 7:38 pm
Location: Kalyves
Contact:

Re: Eastern Crete

Postby filippos » Thu Jan 03, 2019 6:21 pm

Maud wrote:...I was just commenting on Phil’s post, - when he said that his friends who live near Kolymbari are not happy with the thought of yet another large hotel....

My friends' main reason (there are others) for being less than happy about another massive hotel (bigger than the Avra) is how it has affected prices, particularly in tavernas and cafés. Since the Avra opened there's been an inexorable increase in prices year on year and have passed the level that most local people find difficult to afford or find unaffordable.

When saying 'locals' they include non-Greek residents who live part or full time in the locality who are generally better off economically than the native population. I'd classify my friends as "very comfortable" financially yet they say that three or four years ago they ate at their favourite place in Kolymbari at least weekly. Now, and I quote, "We go there no more than once a month, maybe every six weeks because it's got so expensive and in summer you need to book." They also said that admittedly the place had upgraded itself with linen tablecloths, better cutlery and crockery, more staff, refurbished decor etc., but the prices have risen so disproportionately it's become poor value. The knock-on effect, apparently, is that other tavernas have been scrambling to catch up so their prices have risen, too. Added to that is the fact that very many of the people staying at hotels like the Avra are inured to high restaurant prices as they're often even more expensive in their home countries.

It's the same syndrome as housing in parts of the UK where so many people buy second homes in rural or coastal areas - in and around villages and small towns especially - so house prices are driven up and become unaffordable for local people, especially the young. The same applies to "gentrified" areas in cities. When I first moved to London places like Notting Hill, Islington and Whitechapel were places to be avoided but in recent years they've been home to Prime Ministers and bankers with property prices in the multi-millions.

Change isn't always an improvement.

Maud
Posts: 573
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 10:46 pm
Location: S.W. England/ S.W. Crete.

Re: Eastern Crete

Postby Maud » Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:38 pm

As I said Phil.....mass tourism, especially in the form of large hotels, changes the character of an area! Our Greek friends say the same as the people you know. They used to eat out weekly but now it is monthly....if they are lucky! Mind you, that is also due to reductions in their pensions, as well as increasing taverna costs!

Kilkis
Posts: 10385
Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 3:58 pm
Location: Near Chania

Re: Eastern Crete

Postby Kilkis » Thu Jan 03, 2019 11:55 pm

Before the financial crisis I used to see many local people eating in the village taverna on a regular basis. The bank manager and his whole family, the supermarket owner and his family etc etc. Now I never see them eating out. Ever. There is no hotel at all in my village. Not one, big small or in-between. There is not a single tourist in my village. I think your friends are experiencing the effects of a Greece wide depression that is deeper and longer than the great depression of the 1930s rather than the effect of a single large hotel.

Tell your friends to give up on Argentina, Fillipos, and use Niko Faros next door. It's cheaper and the foods better.

Warwick


Return to “General Discussion & News”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 13 guests