FULL Lockdown Monday 23 March 6a.m. in Greece

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Tim
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Re: FULL Lockdown Monday 23 March 6a.m. in Greece

Postby Tim » Mon Apr 06, 2020 10:30 am

chrissyg wrote:It is just adding to the anxiety that we are all feeling at our loss of freedom.


Speaking of which, there is now a nighttime curfew in place on the island of Mykonos. A sign of things to come?

http://www.ekathimerini.com/251375/arti ... quarantine

Tim

Kamisiana
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Re: FULL Lockdown Monday 23 March 6a.m. in Greece

Postby Kamisiana » Mon Apr 06, 2020 10:33 am

Yes some policing is over the top give some of them a uniform and authority it goes to their head putting black dye in a lake is a good example of that thathttps://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/ne ... ne-4002920
some are saying Greece got it right with their lockdown is there a section on the paperwork to leave home that says you can go for a picnic in the park or on the beach,unfortunately 75% of those in the UK flouting the rules are the millennial snowflakes who just live in their own little bubble with a mobile grafted to their hand

Kilkis
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Re: FULL Lockdown Monday 23 March 6a.m. in Greece

Postby Kilkis » Mon Apr 06, 2020 10:48 am

I don't have a problem with the police being there. If they see a large group of people I don't object to them questioning them to see if they are all from the same household. When I was young I lived close to a family that had 13 children. I think if the police saw a group of 15 people all close together but well away from anybody else then they should ascertain if they really are a family group. If they are leave them alone - if they are not tell them to disperse. What I object to is them moving on people, who are alone or in a couple and who are keeping well away from other people, simply because what they are doing doesn't conform to what the police think they should be doing.

I think there has to be some common sense. If a family who live in London decide to get in their car or on a train to go down to Brighton to have a walk on the beach then that is ridiculous. If a family who live in Brighton decide to go for a walk on the beach rather than in their street then I think that is very sensible. They will probably find it a lot easier to social distance on the beach than walking up and down a street. If they sit down fro a while - so what? If they get to the beach to find there are huge numbers of people and social distancing is a problem then they should walk back home. The police should also be using loud hailers to tell people to go home. Being in a park or on a beech or a country lane is not a problem. Lying, sitting, standing, walking, running, skateboarding or cycling are not a problem. Being too close together is the only problem. Police being too close together.

Warwick

chrissyg
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Re: FULL Lockdown Monday 23 March 6a.m. in Greece

Postby chrissyg » Mon Apr 06, 2020 11:25 am

Exactly, some people just don't get it. In the supermarket last week an assistant came a bit too close to me really just to tell me my feet werent on the round spot that they should be on in the queue. I was literally 2 inches behind it.!!
I understand the need for the rules but some people are just too thick to look at things sensibly.

Kamisiana
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Re: FULL Lockdown Monday 23 March 6a.m. in Greece

Postby Kamisiana » Mon Apr 06, 2020 12:00 pm

Looks like the Greeks are no different the the Brits then :lol:
http://www.ekathimerini.com/251387/arti ... violations

Maud
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Re: FULL Lockdown Monday 23 March 6a.m. in Greece

Postby Maud » Mon Apr 06, 2020 12:13 pm

The problem is that the instructions form the Government in the U.K. are not clear enough. It is impossible for the police and the public to understand them! Warwick must have seen the same interview with Hancock (Question Time I think), as me. He stated it was fine for people to go out for exercise, as long as it was local to where they lived. Only an hour before Johnson had stated on a video that people should stay at home. One minute the public and the police are being told it is ok to go out as long as you ‘self distance’ whilst the next they are being told it is only ok if you do it and don’t sit and sunbathe/picnic/rest up.

I cannot see anything wrong with people doing any of the things above if it is with people they live with, and if they are social distancing from others. The problem is that a small minority have abused the situation, and have been gathering with friends in public places under the ‘umbrella’ of taking daily exercise. It has been mostly young people, which is why the government has focused on telling that generation to abide by the instructions. Unfortunately many of them think the virus will not affect then much, even if they catch it, so they are not too worried! The youngsters who are doing this seem oblivious to the fact they might already have the virus and be spreading it!

It is the same old story.....a few spoiling things for the many! The unfortunate thing is that ‘the few’ in this case could have a devastating on others....and the NHS. It seems the easiest way to deal with this is to give the instruction that ‘exercise’ (going for a walk) is the only reason one can go outside. (Not including food shopping, medical appointments etc). It is a way to simplify the instruction. There is also a guidance as to how long this should be. - No more than an hour. All of this is impossible to ‘police.’ We are once again relying on people’s common sense and social duty. Sadly some people will never exhibit either!

I am no lover of the police, but I do think they have a difficult job just now,

As an aside, the Derbyshire police had an impossible task a week ago. The previous weekend local villages had been inundated with tourists. The small shops were being stripped of goods by the visitors, and the locals were furious. The following weekend they tried to prevent the same happening, then got criticised for being over zealous. We are all on a ‘leading curve’ at the moment.

I see Calderwood has gone then! - Not a surprise.

Keltz
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Re: FULL Lockdown Monday 23 March 6a.m. in Greece

Postby Keltz » Mon Apr 06, 2020 12:33 pm

Maud wrote:I see Calderwood has gone then! - Not a surprise.


I wonder when Prince Charles will step down from public duty for doing the same thing.

mouche
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Re: FULL Lockdown Monday 23 March 6a.m. in Greece

Postby mouche » Mon Apr 06, 2020 12:41 pm

April 6, 2020 (Monday):
Regarding tourism this year, government spokesman Stelios Petsas said that it is not certain whether Greece can receive tourists.
The government is doing everything possible to save the season and if the corona crisis should be over relatively quickly, the main season could possibly take place in the third quarter. However, if COVID-19 remains a threat, the government will change its mind.
The idea is to reopen the borders to countries with low infection spread (but probably not to Italy, Spain and the UK), but it must be assumed that every person entering the country will have to undergo a corona test.

cretetip.com

Maud
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Re: FULL Lockdown Monday 23 March 6a.m. in Greece

Postby Maud » Mon Apr 06, 2020 12:57 pm

https://greece.greekreporter.com/2020/0 ... ronavirus/

Even with people ignoring the instructions, Greece still seems to be doing better than most other EU countries.

BST
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Re: FULL Lockdown Monday 23 March 6a.m. in Greece

Postby BST » Mon Apr 06, 2020 2:31 pm

[quote="Keltz"

I wonder when Prince Charles will step down from public duty for doing the same thing.[/quote]

When Prince Charles caught CV he was following the government advice, ie carry on with life but wash hands singing happy birthday twice!

Kilkis
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Re: FULL Lockdown Monday 23 March 6a.m. in Greece

Postby Kilkis » Mon Apr 06, 2020 2:34 pm

I did see Hancock on Question Time, Maud but his comment that I referred to earlier about what people could and couldn't do related to his first press conference after coming out of quarantine where he was asked a question about it.

Obviously the content of some of my posts is critical regarding some of the policing in the UK but it is not my intention to criticise the police as a whole and I agree they have an impossible job. I suspect most of the Greeks who have been fined for breaking the social distancing rules were not a matter of interpretation but rather that they hadn't bothered to fill out the form/send an SMS or were not doing what they said they were. The businesses that opened are not really a matter of interpretation.

I would level one criticism at all governments all over the world. The pandemic started in China. At the beginning there were only cases in China. For the pandemic to spread to another country someone has to bring it into that country from outside. Why didn't countries close their borders more quickly to all people movement? You could allow people to leave, if they have somewhere to go. You could allow residents to return provided they spend 14 days in quarantine, proper quarantine not promising to be good boys and girls and stay at home. All freight could move as normal provided the people moving that freight are closely controlled. If governments had done that first and immediately then all economic activity could go on as normal inside each country. Yes there would be a hit to the economy, e.g. tourism in Greece, but it would be a much smaller hit than the present lockdown is going to cause. The first case detected in Greece was on February 26. If Greece had closed its borders to the outside world on February 27 I wonder what the situation would be today? The first case in Italy was on January 31. What would Europe be like now if Italy had closed its borders on 1 February? The first case in China was probably near the end of November 2019, although the government controlled information flow pretty much to the end of December. By 23 January it had got so bad in Wuhan that the government imposed a total lockdown much stricter than anything people are experiencing here or in the UK. It isn't as if governments here didn't know what was coming. They imposed increasing controls inside the country long before they imposed them on the borders. The villagers of Eyam, ironically in Derbyshire, understood the importance of border control over 350 years ago but today's governments don't seem to have read history.

Warwick

Maud
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Re: FULL Lockdown Monday 23 March 6a.m. in Greece

Postby Maud » Mon Apr 06, 2020 3:02 pm

I think the question about shutting borders earlier, and also lock downs, will be ones that are going to be examined in great detail when all this is over Warwick. There will always be people who say hindsight is a wonderful thing, but there is also the thought that we should learn from the mistakes of others. - I err towards the latter. We all saw what was happening in China, then Italy. We have also seen that ‘social distancing and isolation has been the way to slow down this virus....yet many governments were not prepared to take such huge measures until Corvid 19 had started to cause numerous deaths in their countries.

There will be a lot of questions asked later on!

Kilkis
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Re: FULL Lockdown Monday 23 March 6a.m. in Greece

Postby Kilkis » Mon Apr 06, 2020 4:30 pm

I don't think this one is a question of hindsight. At a point in time you know there are cases elsewhere in the world. and you believe you have no cases in your country. The only way you can get cases is from people coming from abroad. Preventing getting cases by stopping people coming into your country from abroad is not rocket science. All the initial cases in Greece, and in every other country except China, came from abroad. It might not be 100 % successful but it ought to be the very first step not the tenth or twentieth.

Warwick

Maud
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Re: FULL Lockdown Monday 23 March 6a.m. in Greece

Postby Maud » Mon Apr 06, 2020 5:03 pm

I agree totally Warwick.

Joan
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Re: FULL Lockdown Monday 23 March 6a.m. in Greece

Postby Joan » Mon Apr 06, 2020 6:37 pm

[quote][/If a family who live in Brighton decide to go for a walk on the beach rather than in their street then I think that is very sensible. They will probably find it a lot easier to social distance on the beach than walking up and down a street. quote]

Not quite how it's working out in a large coastal town very near to Brighton...

The promenade along the beach has been totally manic since the lock-down started - it's full of cyclists, OAPs on buggies, walkers, joggers, adults on scooters, families with small children (often miles ahead of the parents) on scooters - all bearing down on you from front and back. I think they are all townspeople. It was a bit madder still over the weekend, I guess because some people are still working Mon-Fri.

Instead of the beach, we're walking some long and quiet town roads and streets with wide pavements. If anyone approaches, one group or the other dodges onto the street (there is no traffic but there are lots of parked cars to hide behind for as long as is necessary) - or crosses to the other side of the road. Everyone there is being very sensible. They are probably older on average than those on the sea-front...

Joan

(Sorry - can't work out how to do the quote.)


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