Lockdown rules get tougher...

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Kilkis
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Re: Lockdown rules get tougher...

Postby Kilkis » Tue Mar 30, 2021 4:13 pm

Using 3 is correct:

    Go to a public service, if the electronic or telephone service is not possible only for urgent needs, after setting an appointment for which the citizen is informed in writing or electronically and under the additional condition of demonstrating the above information. As well as going to the bank, to the extent that electronic transaction is not possible.
    To go to a public service or bank, the code 3 is used in the SMS.

Technically you are supposed to have confirmation of the appointment in writing or electronically. Since the police are making appointments but not confirming them in writing or electronically, as far as I can see it is the police who are breaking the rule.

Warwick

PS This applies to all levels of restriction not just to red or red +

jane m clayton
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Re: Lockdown rules get tougher...

Postby jane m clayton » Wed Mar 31, 2021 6:28 pm

We asked if we would be sent a message or called to say the cards were ready, and he said'...we did that to start with, but there are around 7,000 of you, so not now'.

Jeffstclair
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Location: The centre of the universe

Re: Lockdown rules get tougher...

Postby Jeffstclair » Thu Apr 01, 2021 6:09 am

Well yesterday was a breeze ... I did the hour and a half drive to Αγιου Νικολαου ...To be honest it was great to get out of the village for a bit ... The roads were very empty, the little fiat got a bit of an Italian tune up... I found the police station , it took half an hour to go through my papers and got given a" cover note "..job done . There was an open market just up the road from the police station so I was able to do a bit of shopping for fresh veg ..result . I have to go back to another police station in Αγιου Νικολαου in a few days because the passport office that does the finger prints does not open on Wednesdays ... and another trip later to the permit office to pick up the new permit I guess.

Kilkis
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Re: Lockdown rules get tougher...

Postby Kilkis » Thu Apr 01, 2021 7:57 am

jane m clayton wrote:We asked if we would be sent a message or called to say the cards were ready, and he said'...we did that to start with, but there are around 7,000 of you, so not now'.


Everybody I know has been called to tell them that their card is ready for collection, Jane, otherwise how will you know when to go for it? I don't know anybody who has been sent an SMS. The number of people applying for a card has not changed but certainly the rate of processing seems to be increasing.

The basic process hasn't changed at all, Jeff, but the detail seems to. At the Chania police station you need to make an appointment for the fingerprinting visit and I would guess that is the same in Αγιος Νικολαος. Originally in Chania you went down to the passport office and made the appointment immediately after the application visit but after a few weeks they changed it so you had to phone to get one. It takes about 1 week give or take between the fingerprinting visit and collecting the card. I went back to the same office to collect my card but now they are making people wait outside. Someone comes out periodically, collects a batch of the application verification papers, i.e. what you describe as a "cover note", then brings out the cards and distributes them.

I think having an appointment for each visit is important with the current COVID infection levels and movement restrictions. They might not give you written confirmation of an appointment but at least you have a chance of getting off a fine if you have an appointment. For example when you go for the first visit you will have the e-Paravolo with you and that states on it what it is for. When you go for the fingerprinting visit and to collect the card you will have the application verification document with you. All these prove the purpose of your journey and also effectively where you are going, since there is a limited number of police stations doing the process, even if they don't prove the time of your appointment. I think you have a good chance of talking your way out of getting a fien issued or, if you do get a ticket, a good chance of getting it annulled.

A married couple I know, who have lived here for many years and both have a blue permanent residence certificate, were contacted yesterday and told to also bring proof of income and proof of health insurance. They were told "the rules have changed". That is a complete nonsense. The rules are based on on the Withdrawal Agreement and the terms of that are based on Directive 2004/38/EC. Neither of those have changed nor has the official police web site that sets out the requirements.

Warwick

evansmr1
Posts: 391
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Location: Pirgos, Kalo Horio,

Re: Lockdown rules get tougher...

Postby evansmr1 » Thu Apr 01, 2021 10:26 am

Warwick wrote
The basic process hasn't changed at all, Jeff, but the detail seems to. At the Chania police station you need to make an appointment for the fingerprinting visit and I would guess that is the same in Αγιος Νικολαος.


The Passport Office Police in Ag.Nik Call to make the recipient to make the appointment, you do not call them. This is usually 2 weeks after the first appointment.
Mike
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Sic parvis magna

Jeffstclair
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Re: Lockdown rules get tougher...

Postby Jeffstclair » Thu Apr 01, 2021 10:43 am

evansmr1 wrote:
Warwick wrote
The basic process hasn't changed at all, Jeff, but the detail seems to. At the Chania police station you need to make an appointment for the fingerprinting visit and I would guess that is the same in Αγιος Νικολαος.


The Passport Office Police in Ag.Nik Call to make the recipient to make the appointment, you do not call them. This is usually 2 weeks after the first appointment.



Yes, that is what the very helpful and clued up Argiris Tsakarakis who seems to run the permit issuing department told me, however he also told me he tries when it's possible to get people like me who live in the far East to get their fingerprints done on the same day ...but this was not possible yesterday 'cos the passport office is only open in the evening...

Rick
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Re: Lockdown rules get tougher...

Postby Rick » Thu Apr 01, 2021 11:13 am

Kilkis wrote:A married couple I know, who have lived here for many years and both have a blue permanent residence certificate, were contacted yesterday and told to also bring proof of income and proof of health insurance. They were told "the rules have changed".

Out of interest, was this request prior to them attending their first application appointment? As you say, they can't change the withdrawal agreement rules, but perhaps they are adhering to them more rigorousely - I fully expected to provide proof of income and health insurance at my appointment, and was surprised when the Chania police dept., didn't request these two items.

Kilkis
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Re: Lockdown rules get tougher...

Postby Kilkis » Thu Apr 01, 2021 11:46 am

They made an appointment for today a few weeks ago. When they made the appointment they were told to bring the usual stuff for people who hold a blue permanent residence certificate. Yesterday they were phoned by the police office and told they also needed to bring proof of health insurance and proof of income. The following is copied directly from the official police document for people who hold an EU residence certificate, linked on the official police web site, my comments in blue and emphasis in red:

    In case of non-permanent residence: (i.e. beige certificate)
    - Registration Certificate of Citizen of Member State of EU
    - Proof that he/she continues to reside in Greece and meets one of the requirements of the Directive 2004/38/EC as below:

    In case of article 7 par. 1 (b) of Directive 2004/38/EC: (i.e. condition of self sufficient)
    - Sufficient resources for themselves and their family members not to become a burden on the social assistance system of Greece during their period of residence.
    - Comprehensive sickness insurance cover in Greece.

    In case of permanent residence: (i.e. blue certificate)
    - Permanent Residence Document of Citizen of Member State of EU
    If the applicant holds the Permanent Residence Document of Citizen of Member State of EU, visits and applies for the residence document under 18 (4) of the WA, within 5 years from the date of issuance of the permanent residence document (period during which the continuity is not broken), then not any other documentation is needed for this purpose.

    - Proof for the non -absence of more than five (5) consecutive years from Greece.
    In case where the Permanent Residence Document has been issued more than five years before the date application for the residence document under 18 (4) of the WA, the applicant should provide with proof for the non-absence from Greece for more 5 consecutive years within the period of acquisition of the permanent residence right and the submission of the application for the residence document under WA. Proof for this purpose may be rental contracts, public utility bills, tax statements, travel tickets to Greece and any other document for this purpose.

It is absolutely explicit that proof of income and health insurance is only required for beige certificate holders and not for blue certificate holders, although the latter can be asked to prove that they have not been absent for more than 5 years since the certificate was issued if it is more than 5 years old. I have not heard of anybody being asked to do this.

The above is obtained by following links on the official government web site that provides advice for UK citizens resident in Greece and so is current.

Warwick

PS There are also requirements listed for non-permanent residents who are working in Greece or are students, i.e. article 7 par. 1 (a) and 1 (c) of Directive 2004/38/EC but I didn't copy those as I guess most people are in the self sufficient category.

evansmr1
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Re: Lockdown rules get tougher...

Postby evansmr1 » Thu Apr 01, 2021 3:05 pm

I believe that some of these Posts are going off subject. Residency requirements are not part of the Subject "Lockdown Rules are getting tougher". There is an excellent section regarding Applying for Residency Biometric card.

Last night the Government has slightly relaxed Weekend Rules, we can now go out of our Municipality in our cars/Motorcycles for exercising, use SMS 6. BUT we must not stray out of our Prefecture. Yippee, I get to drive my car more than the 21 kms return that it takes to do our weekly shop. Roll on Saturday.
Mike
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Tim
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Re: Lockdown rules get tougher...

Postby Tim » Thu Apr 01, 2021 3:26 pm

evansmr1 wrote:I believe that some of these Posts are going off subject. Residency requirements are not part of the Subject "Lockdown Rules are getting tougher". There is an excellent section regarding Applying for Residency Biometric card.

Last night the Government has slightly relaxed Weekend Rules, we can now go out of our Municipality in our cars/Motorcycles for exercising, use SMS 6. BUT we must not stray out of our Prefecture. Yippee, I get to drive my car more than the 21 kms return that it takes to do our weekly shop. Roll on Saturday.


As ever with pronouncements from the Greek authorities there is ambiguity in the message. Taken from this link:
https://www.ekathimerini.com/news/1158354/greece-relaxes-some-lockdown-measures-despite-virus-surge/

The recent measure restricting exercise to any location people could either walk or cycle to was also lifted, with Hardalias announcing driving outside one’s home municipality will be allowed again as of Saturday, but only at weekends. Exercise can be conducted with a maximum of three people, or one family group.

Does that mean you can or can't go outside your municipality on a Saturday to go shopping? Typical.

Tim

Kilkis
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Re: Lockdown rules get tougher...

Postby Kilkis » Thu Apr 01, 2021 4:34 pm

A transcript of the briefing is here. It is in Greek but translates quite well in Chrome browser. It avoids relying on what the papers say.

The relaxation to the rule to allow movement outside your municipality discussed in the briefing is with SMS 6 and is only for exercise. See this paragraph from Hardalias' part of the briefing:

    In addition, the Government has decided that from Saturday, April 3, and only for weekends, to use code 6 to be allowed to travel for personal exercise by vehicle in the open air up to 3 people or a family and to avoid any mass gathering.

Having said that, it has never been clear if the rule to do essential shopping only within your municipality always applied to everybody or only to very high risk areas. I can no longer find any definitive web page that specifies the current rules in total. This page is now well out of date and a lot of the previously announced restrictions no longer appear on it.

Warwick

BST
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Re: Lockdown rules get tougher...

Postby BST » Thu Apr 01, 2021 5:08 pm

Rick wrote:
Kilkis wrote:A married couple I know, who have lived here for many years and both have a blue permanent residence certificate, were contacted yesterday and told to also bring proof of income and proof of health insurance. They were told "the rules have changed".

Out of interest, was this request prior to them attending their first application appointment? As you say, they can't change the withdrawal agreement rules, but perhaps they are adhering to them more rigorousely - I fully expected to provide proof of income and health insurance at my appointment, and was surprised when the Chania police dept., didn't request these two items.


Sorry off thread! We had THE phonecall today!! Appointment next Wednesday. I questioned the need for health insurance with blue permit and was told, no health insurance no biometric permit! I know that's wrong but couldn't be bothered putting up a fight. Very annoying as entitled to S1 cover next month, which I explained to him.....but no budging. Also proof of income, 6 months UK bank statements.

lDm
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Re: Lockdown rules get tougher...

Postby lDm » Thu Apr 01, 2021 8:09 pm

digesting today's updates on restrictions, I'm inclined to conclude that weekend outings are best avoided precisely because there'll be 'crowding' to cities.. (ab)using the lax on 'groups' or 3 people in a car. I remain pessimistic that after 1-2 weekends of shop & 'coastal house' visits, in context of current peaks (Heraklion, but also Chania/Rethymno get a spike every 3rd day or so..) and early tourism... cases will increase.

shine on
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Re: Lockdown rules get tougher...

Postby shine on » Thu Apr 01, 2021 9:31 pm

So I take it with retail shops opening on Monday on a click & collect basis, and 3 hour time limit, this means we can go out of our municipality to shop? Saturday is for exercise only. All confusing, it’s enough to drive one to drink. :?

Tim
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Re: Lockdown rules get tougher...

Postby Tim » Sat Apr 03, 2021 9:46 am

So, it seems you can now shop outside your own municipality, according to the latest update.

https://www.keeptalkinggreece.com/2021/ ... n-april-2/

I think the PS on this article also applies, though. :wink:

Tim


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