Cost of "legalisation"

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greekboy
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Postby greekboy » Sat Nov 26, 2011 6:49 am

Once the house has been certified it is valid for 12 mths not 30 years, don't know what the fee is for renewing. Think the 30 year figure was for registering the property not for certification
Fred

moved 2 crete
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Postby moved 2 crete » Sat Nov 26, 2011 5:13 pm

It maybe the authorities want us expats all to go home leaving the properties empty then sell them on to greeks at knocked down prices, because the way they are going about it there are more and more houses on the property market as expats packup and go they are also leaving rental property, it will become the last straw. the latest one I know of bought at 95000 euros and sold at 75000 euros on a small plot with no pool.
Dave H

greekboy
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Postby greekboy » Sat Nov 26, 2011 6:34 pm

It does appear that many foreighners are leaving or trying to but finding it very difficult because its nearly impossible to sell their houses unless heavily discounted and even then there is a real shortage of buyers. I think anyone thinking of buying in Greece / Crete is waiting to see what happens to the country and you can't blame them
Fred

bobscott
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Postby bobscott » Sat Nov 26, 2011 6:57 pm

Kilkis wrote:Perhaps I've gone native but I have a completely different take on this.

I built a free standing, i.e. not attached to the house, wooden carport with a tiled roof several years after the house was built. As far as I am concerned it is not a permanent structure and not, therefore, liable for building permission or a licence fee. If, at any time, the authorities challenge this I will simply remove it. Since their ultimate sanction is to demolish the offending structure I will have effectively carried out this sanction for them. Obviously, if the reason for doing this is to sell the property I would be happy to return the components to the buyer and arrange for it to re-erected after the sale is complete.

Warwick


Says, tongue in cheek of course I suppose you paid the IKA contribution when you built it, and that you will likewise pay the IKA contribution when you demolish it!

We have been quoted €1800 all in (fine, fees) for legalising a garage underbuild not shown on the original permit. 42.5 square metres. Sounds very reasonable to me in comparison what others are being told.
Yesterday today was tomorrow. Don't dilly dally!

al'Miral
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Postby al'Miral » Sun Nov 27, 2011 9:13 am

Just about the hardest thing we have learned to swallow in our years here is the mind-boggling inconsistency in which laws/rules are applied. It is endemic and one of the key reasons why Greece is, and will stay, in the state that it is in.

Given the lessons of history which is generally that those who laugh last laugh longest we are dug in and propose to stay dug in with our six months supply of non-perishable food-stuffs. When Greece defaults and leaves the euro - if Germany doesn't cause a break up of the euro zone by leaving first - we shall still be here.

In the final analysis it will be up to our heirs to deal with a decision to enjoy the place or pack up.

mouche
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Postby mouche » Sun Nov 27, 2011 12:11 pm

bobscott wrote:
Kilkis wrote:We have been quoted €1800 all in (fine, fees) for legalising a garage underbuild not shown on the original permit. 42.5 square metres. Sounds very reasonable to me in comparison what others are being told.


Have been told by my builder that the cost of "legalising" a construction is based on the estimated value/cost of the construction of what has been illegealy built plus a fee to the engineer. In our case the cost of legalising 80 m2 basement to living space is 5,140 euro (for the builder!) and the cost of legalising roof over the carport and two pergolas will be max 2000 euro. The builders engineer will negotiate with his engineer -friends at the office where this is being taken care of.

bettyboo
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cost of legalisation

Postby bettyboo » Sun Nov 27, 2011 1:04 pm

Does that include the IKA fine as well

mouche
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Postby mouche » Sun Nov 27, 2011 1:59 pm

Supposedly includes "everything".

Kilkis
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Postby Kilkis » Sun Nov 27, 2011 7:38 pm

bobscott wrote:...Says, tongue in cheek of course I suppose you paid the IKA contribution when you built it, and that you will likewise pay the IKA contribution when you demolish it!...


What IKA contribution? We look after four feral cats. To give them shelter we bought a couple of plastic dog kennels on which we paid VAT. They came in pieces and I had to assemble them. Should I have paid IKA?

If you look outside Carefour near Mournies there is a plastic shed for sale. It is bigger than the kennels but it basically bolts together and can be taken down again in a very short period of time. If I bought it I would pay VAT on it. Should I pay IKA to erect it on my garden? Why? Why is it different from the kennels?

My carport consists of wooden beams bolted together with metal plates. VAT was paid on all the components when they were bought. Why should I pay IKA to erect that? None of these are permanent structures. None are habitable structures.

Outside our living room is a terrace with an open pergola. If I put a roof on it, it would mean we could sit on it when it is raining but we couldn't "live" in it. It is completely open to the elements. It would be freezing cold in winter. Should it be classed as an extra room? Why? If I walled it in and it became an habitable part of the house I can understand that I would need to pay for a building permit and pay IKA but not simply for stopping rain.

Warwick

bobscott
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Postby bobscott » Sun Nov 27, 2011 8:00 pm

Well Warwick, it was a tongue-in-cheek remark reflecting the fact that if you build anything yourself, you still have to pay a notional IKA contribution for the invisible workperson you employed! Bob.
Yesterday today was tomorrow. Don't dilly dally!

filippos
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Postby filippos » Sun Nov 27, 2011 8:18 pm

All absolutely logical, Warwick, but what does logic have to do with it?. I think I'm right in saying, unless the law has changed, that a) any new construction work - like tiling a pergola is deemed to be - requires permission or it's illegal and b) that if you apply for permission there will be attached to the licence a schedule of the hours needed by a specialist and/or labourer to complete the work.

The amount of IKA due will be calculated and demanded whether the work is done by 'professionals' or DIY. Of course, it's not logical but .......... Do you pay VAT on the materials used?

It's not quite the same as a freestanding, bolted together plastic kennel or shed.

bobscott
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Postby bobscott » Mon Nov 28, 2011 9:52 am

filippos wrote: I think I'm right in saying, unless the law has changed, that a) any new construction work - like tiling a pergola is deemed to be - requires permission or it's illegal and b) that if you apply for permission there will be attached to the licence a schedule of the hours needed by a specialist and/or labourer to complete the work.

The amount of IKA due will be calculated and demanded whether the work is done by 'professionals' or DIY. Of course, it's not logical but .......... Do you pay VAT on the materials used?

It's not quite the same as a freestanding, bolted together plastic kennel or shed.


That's my understanding too Phil. Bob.
Yesterday today was tomorrow. Don't dilly dally!

al'Miral
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Postby al'Miral » Mon Nov 28, 2011 6:00 pm

I do wonder if someone - preferably a Greek - will take the lunacy that is applied as a rule or law to the courts and get it to the EU courts. I have no doubt that much of what is applied is basically illegal and against a persons human rights. Of course, this was tried a few days ago in re. the cutting off of electricity when the property tax was not paid. The EU said it was illegal to cut off the electricty on the basis that the collection of tax is nothing whatsoever to do with the electricity. The two are not a provision of the electricity company and it is only being forced to be an agent of the state. The authorities in Athens said that as far as they were concerned it was legal.

filippos
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Postby filippos » Mon Nov 28, 2011 6:41 pm

al'Miral wrote:...... on the basis that the collection of tax is nothing whatsoever to do with the electricity. The two are not a provision of the electricity company and it is only being forced to be an agent of the state.
Isn't the local council tax collected by the electricity company? Is the additionion of an amount for TV a tax or a fee?

Everyone seems happy enough for those to be collected by the electricity company. Is it desirable to spend money the state doesn't have to set up a separate collection system?

Rej
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Postby Rej » Tue Nov 29, 2011 11:27 am

At the meeting in Vrises which, for many of the English speaking community, started this ball rolling, it was made clear that once a structure has been "legalised" no further claims for taxes, fees, etc, are allowed. This includes IKA demands.


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