SYRIZA

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norton57
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SYRIZA

Postby norton57 » Tue Jan 27, 2015 6:52 pm

Hi, not sure if this should be posted under the 'Election Results' topic but was wondering if Syriza's election win will have any implications for those ex pats who own a property in Crete. I note that Alexis Tsipras is a former communist and was hoping that he doesn't view us as monsters of capitalism, i know it's only speculation but does anyone know if he has ever spoken on the subject?

Ray
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Re: SYRIZA

Postby Ray » Wed Jan 28, 2015 2:27 am

To the best of my knowledge, Tsipariz has not made any statements referring to British ex-pats/ Problem is that he is a communist who does not speak to the Eek, the communist party of Greece,yet his first considered duty today after rejecting priests in his swearing in, was to go lay flowers on the tomb of the dead communists of the resistance - not to go to the memorial for the war dead of greece in Athens centre. So with him anything can happen. Right now he has to try to get the debate started with the troika, he can do that without falling out with his new Independent greeks who are part of his coalition.After that there will be a fight. The NIGreeks are very right wing and believe in ejecting immigrants especially jews so anything could happen. Best cross our fingers and wait for thr best.

Ray

Ray
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Re: SYRIZA

Postby Ray » Wed Jan 28, 2015 3:03 am

Also there were only 9,808,760 people called up to vote. Syriza only got 36.3% of those so he got 99 seats. As his was the strongest party in the vote, then he gets given 50 seats more under the greek election making it up to149 seats, two short. so he needs a coalition party. He won't choose Nea Dimocratia. EEK, To Potami and if he does not want to make greeks look stupid around the he won't go for Golden Dawn, so really he hass one choice, The Independent Greeks who hate austerity (good) but also hate just about everyone else especially immigrants and their children who if born in greece,do not get greek nationality. they're apparently antsemitic and hate the arab spring and the boats arriving in greece, maybe they like coffee. Syriza can get talks going with them in his coalition with the Germans, The ECB/IMF and Merkel but their response may well be a hard NO. If thats the case Syriza is stuffed and will probably end the coalition. The Independent Greek who dont love Syriza much anyway will be out on there own and syriza has minimal policies to cope with this, still I guess he can dream some up.

Ray

Kilkis
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Re: SYRIZA

Postby Kilkis » Wed Jan 28, 2015 11:54 am

There are several communist parties in Greece each tending to follow a different doctrine of communism, Maoist, Marxist, Trotskyite etc. Syriza formed as an umbrella group of people who had left these various factions. As such it was far left. It became a party, I think for the 2012 election, because the way they would be dealt with in an election as an umbrella group is different from the way a formal party is treated. As a party it attracted people disaffected with other parties, mostly from PASOK and the Democratic Left. KKE, the biggest communist party and the one that got seats in parliament, hate Syriza because they see it as having stolen their ground in the political arena. They are seen as traitors to the communist cause so there is little chance of any alliance there, ever.

Because of their roots they were initially very anti-Euro and anti-EU. That view has softened over time possibly because of entrants from other parties but probably principally because it is clear that the vast majority of Greeks, typically around 75 %, are pro-Euro and pro EU. People voted for them because they promised to end austerity and Greeks are fed up with austerity, for very good reasons.

Syriza has a very accepting policy when it comes to immigrants. For example they want to grant nationality to a range of immigrants, such as children of immigrants born in Greece. I don't see Syriza as a direct threat to ex-pats, therefore. They may represent an indirect threat in that failed negotiations on debt could result in both a withdrawal from the Euro and a withdrawal from the EU. I don't think that extreme outcome is likely but we have discussed previously the possible problems that a UK EU exit could cause and I guess those problems would be the same for a Greek EU exit.

Independent Greeks, on the other hand, are almost as right wing as Golden Dawn. They are racist, xenophobic, homophobic, anti-Semitic and their policies reflect these views. I cannot see them getting any of these policies adopted so I don't think they represent a threat either. Even if they did start to pursue these policies, initially at least, they would be concentrated on illegal immigrants, Jews, Muslims etc. WASPS would have little to fear.

Warwick

norton57
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Re: SYRIZA

Postby norton57 » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:17 pm

Thanks for replies, though i'm not sure about his policies, from what i've read in english papers Tsipiras seems genuine enough and untainted by the corruption so endemic in greek politics of the past. 'Modest apartment ' in Athens, preferred means of transport 'a small motorbike', time will tell!

Ray
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Re: SYRIZA

Postby Ray » Wed Jan 28, 2015 5:25 pm

If you want to find out more about Tsipras himself you can look here on Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexis_Tsipras

Ray

Kilkis
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Re: SYRIZA

Postby Kilkis » Wed Jan 28, 2015 6:56 pm

norton57 wrote:...Tsipiras seems ... untainted by the corruption so endemic in greek politics of the past...


I would tend to agree with that view. One hope for his government is that they will genuinely tackle corruption but it is a massive task. Every minister appointed by Tsipras will head up a ministry run by public servants. It is virtually certain that the administrative head of the ministry will be corrupt. If you get rid of him it is virtually certain that the head of each administrative department within the ministry will be corrupt. Repeat this process until you get down to the janitor. Not sure about him.

Several years ago, when ND replaced PASOK in government, I was told by a Greek businessman, who was a supporter of ND, that things would be much better. Contracts would progress much more rapidly. A few months later he had steam coming out of his ears. Karamanlis had made a lot of noise about stopping corruption. This had worried everybody in the contract chain. They were frightened to accept their usual bribes, in case there really was a clamp down, but obviously they weren't going to issue contracts without the bribes. Thus everything was clogged up. It took a significant part of the Karamanlis administration before it was realised nothing was going to be done and everything got back to normal. That and the fact that many senior people in the administration were PASOK appointees made it extremely difficult for that ND government to get anything done.

Warwick

BST
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Re: SYRIZA

Postby BST » Wed Jan 28, 2015 8:17 pm

This is the article that interests me as regards impact on expats. Looks like ENIFA will be abolished apart from holiday homes and luxury properties ??
http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/_w_ar ... 015_546584

YoMo2
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Re: SYRIZA

Postby YoMo2 » Wed Jan 28, 2015 10:32 pm

It will actually be fascinating to see what happens about taxation. I think I'm right in saying that the state's tax income has gone down consistently over each of the 5 previous years. So much for increasing tax levels. As has been demonstrated in many countries over many years, cranking up taxes usually results in lower tax income overall for the state.

Apparently Syriza are talking about abolishing the tax on heating oil, so if you need some don't rush.

We live in interesting times...........

Andrew

Clio
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Re: SYRIZA

Postby Clio » Wed Jan 28, 2015 10:42 pm

Syriza are talking about abolishing the tax on heating oil


Makari!

Where did you see/hear that, Andrew?

Kilkis
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Re: SYRIZA

Postby Kilkis » Wed Jan 28, 2015 11:56 pm

A property tax on "expensive" properties applied a long time before any of the new property taxes were introduced. The threshold to determine "expensive" varied over time. There was also a period of two or three years, before the tax was put on the electricity bill, where the exemption from paying it below a certain value only applied to the primary residence. Since many ex-pats were registered as non-tax resident they couldn't claim that their house in Crete was their primary residence and so they had to pay the tax on more modest properties. I think that was scrapped the year before the tax was put on the electricity bill. Possibly earlier. It sounds like Syriza are proposing to go back to that sort of regime.

I also read reports that Syriza intended to scrap the tax on heating oil.

Warwick

YoMo2
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Re: SYRIZA

Postby YoMo2 » Thu Jan 29, 2015 8:20 am

Clio, the reference to the heating oil tax is in this article: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-31003070

But equally interesting is the headline. Why would you give up your bargaining counter before you've even started? Unless he just wants to get hold of the money needed in Feb/March,and then hit them with it.......

Andrew

Blighty
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Re: SYRIZA

Postby Blighty » Thu Jan 29, 2015 12:17 pm

With regard to ENIFA tax, it would seem likely then, that unless an expat is classed as tax resident in Greece, they will be required to pay the ENIFA tax .......sadly, most expats will pay it then.

altohb
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Re: SYRIZA

Postby altohb » Thu Jan 29, 2015 1:02 pm

I imagine some of this amounts to a wish list but the comments about tax are of relevance to most of us, I imagine, especially those of us who ARE tax resident here - return of €12000 nil tax band would be very welcome!

http://syriza.net.gr/index.php/en/these ... nt-will-do

George
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Re: SYRIZA

Postby George » Thu Jan 29, 2015 1:06 pm

Mr Tsipras being reported as stopping all construction of new all inclusive hotels as they give nothing to the local economy. As someone else noted, interesting times indeed. I wonder if this means he will go down the route of opening up all year round availability for tourism.


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