Greece Referendum

For discussion, news, comments, questions and information about Crete & Greece.

Referendum

Poll ended at Sat Jul 04, 2015 11:05 am

I believe the Greek government should accept the terms of the ultimatum issued by the creditors
8
19%
I believe the Greek government should reject the terms of the ultimatum issued by the creditors
35
81%
 
Total votes: 43

Kilkis
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Re: Greece Referendum

Postby Kilkis » Sat Jul 04, 2015 5:51 pm

filippos wrote:...We've had nobody asking about us...


Me neither, Filippos. I guess nobody loves us?

Warwick

scooby
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Re: Greece Referendum

Postby scooby » Sun Jul 05, 2015 6:59 am

Seems like poor Merkel can't get a word in :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0chDVGiwqbw
Men in suits will always make you pay.

Jeffstclair
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Re: Greece Referendum

Postby Jeffstclair » Sun Jul 05, 2015 9:03 am

A question ,does anyone know who does the counting in this referendum....? jeff....

footscapes
Posts: 395
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Re: Greece Referendum

Postby footscapes » Sun Jul 05, 2015 10:41 am

The counting is carried out by a Greek systems/software supplier called Singular Logic. They are a big supplier of systems to the Greek public sector as well as to commercial clients.

http://portal.singularlogic.eu/en

Paul

Jeffstclair
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Re: Greece Referendum

Postby Jeffstclair » Sun Jul 05, 2015 11:32 am

Oh right ,the same singular logic that are owned or part ownd by the Marfin group ....a bank ....mmmmmm jeff

Jeffstclair
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Re: Greece Referendum

Postby Jeffstclair » Sun Jul 05, 2015 8:29 pm

It looks like they might just do it .......jeff

Guy M
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Location: Kalamitsi Alexandrou

Re: Greece Referendum

Postby Guy M » Sun Jul 05, 2015 8:51 pm

And what then? Greece was in a very poor way before the last ten days. The abruptness of the referendum, the name-calling, the frozen banks, the picture of a 77 year old man sitting outside a bank in Thessaloniki crying because he can't get his wife's pension....this is where things are now. The negotiating position won't be stronger as the result of an Oxi vote - I can't believe that anyone thinks that. Rather, there'll be vengeance in the air and any settlement will take longer to come through. And the country is split in two over what to do. I think this is the definition of a Pyrrhic victory if I've ever seen one.

Kilkis
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Location: Near Chania

Re: Greece Referendum

Postby Kilkis » Sun Jul 05, 2015 8:58 pm

Sky are reporting that it looks like a 61 % NO vote. If that is the case it is a pretty resounding endorsement of Syriza's stance. I'm not sure how much weight it will carry? I don't think the creditors are interested in what the Greek people think. I hope I am wrong. Given the vote and the report from the IMF, as a scientist I don't see how the creditors can refuse to offer a better deal including debt relief. Sadly, the creditors are not scientists they are politicians. Given that I don't see how they can offer a better deal.

Warwick

Kilkis
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Re: Greece Referendum

Postby Kilkis » Sun Jul 05, 2015 9:03 pm

I guess one good thing is that it is a NO vote across the whole country. See http://i.guim.co.uk/img/static/sys-imag ... b4431aac2e

Warwick

Kilkis
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Re: Greece Referendum

Postby Kilkis » Sun Jul 05, 2015 9:05 pm

Valid comment from the Greens:

Caroline Lucas MP, who represents the British south coast constituency of Brighton Pavilion, says the eurozone must now accept that Greece needs debt relief:

“The Greek people have made a decision which must now be respected. This referendum has seen EU states do their very best to undermine the democratic will of the Greek people but it’s time to draw a line under the past and move onwards.

“History shows us that countries can escape crippling debt in a just way. In 1953, at London Conference, Greece was among the European nations signing a deal which allowed for the cancellation of German debt, to enable the country to grow again after the destruction of the Second World War. Europe needs to come together to offer the Greeks a deal which allows their country to be rebuilt.”

Perhaps Merkel should take note

Warwick

Guy M
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Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:20 pm
Location: Kalamitsi Alexandrou

Re: Greece Referendum

Postby Guy M » Sun Jul 05, 2015 9:08 pm

I suppose the only way they can offer a better deal is if the cost of Greece leaving the euro is seen as being too great - there was a report today of the German cabinet being told how many billions of Euros this would cost Germany, for example. If that was so, a high No vote might be a way of face-saving for the European politicians who are very conscious of what their own electorate think. Bit of a long shot, though.

Kilkis
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Re: Greece Referendum

Postby Kilkis » Sun Jul 05, 2015 9:21 pm

That is the heart of the problem, Guy. Every political leader in the Eurozone is elected purely in his/her own country. Since the aim is always to stay in power their decisions are dictated by their own electorate. No politician in Europe has ever said, "I am voting for X because it is best for Europe". In every single situation the message is always, "I am voting for X because it is best for ....". Insert your country of choice. Until that changes, and I don't think it ever will, the Eurozone will remain dysfunctional.

Warwick

filippos
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Re: Greece Referendum

Postby filippos » Sun Jul 05, 2015 9:53 pm

Kilkis wrote: ...... and I don't think it ever will, the Eurozone will remain dysfunctional.



...... and I don't think it ever will, the EU will remain dysfunctional. There, fixed it.

Topdriller
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Re: Greece Referendum

Postby Topdriller » Sun Jul 05, 2015 10:39 pm

Europe will have to listen. The people in Italy, Portugal and Spain have witnessed the Greek vote. They too hate the EU imposed austerity. The problem for the bankers, political suits and unelected lackeys is an Italian or Spanish default would bring the whole thing crashing down. The markets will smell blood tomorrow and will see a profit in betting against another default. Merkel has already called a Eurozone meeting and whilst the Greeks won't be let off they may well get their much needed debt relief and ECB refunding of their insolvent banks.

Then again....

Jon
We need men who dream of things that never were.

SatCure
Posts: 1890
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Location: Apokoronas

Re: Greece Referendum

Postby SatCure » Sun Jul 05, 2015 11:03 pm

Don't overlook the fact that Greece pretty much has an open invitation from Putin to join the BRICS bank. They can pay in instalments but get immediate access to funds. It's unlikely to happen but neither the EU nor USA will want to take the risk.

In addition, the IMF has stated categorically that Greece needs debt relief and Greece has just got itself a massive sympathy vote from around the world. The pressure is now very much on the EU to get the finances sorted ASAP.

The alternative is a default and Grexit from the Euro and, while that might be hurtful to Greece in the short term, it would be a massive financial blow to the EU and USA. Ain't gonna happen, in my opinion.


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