Renting AirBnb? Finance Ministry is looking for you..

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Carolina
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Renting AirBnb? Finance Ministry is looking for you..

Postby Carolina » Thu Aug 31, 2017 6:35 pm

Data receiving for Internet rentals is in progress

The Treasury have begun looking for taxpayers renting real estate through electronic platforms like Airbnb, Auditors have already requested data from international platforms for properties registered on them.

According to Deputy Finance Minister Katerina Papanatsiou, the ministry is working with international platforms to send data, adding that circulars will be activated to register real estate in the Short-Term Real Estate Register.

http://www.zarpanews.gr/%CE%BD%CE%BF%CE ... %AF%CE%BF/
Article is in Greek but you can use google translate.

KateD
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Re: Renting AirBnb? Finance Ministry is looking for you..

Postby KateD » Thu Aug 31, 2017 7:32 pm

We have already asked to go onto the register as it came into force on January 1st but apparently they still haven't got their act together! :lol: :lol: :lol:

YoMo2
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Re: Renting AirBnb? Finance Ministry is looking for you..

Postby YoMo2 » Wed Sep 06, 2017 8:56 am

I wonder what they will do with all that information once everyone has registered their property on the system? They must have some reason for changing what was a quite complicated system of getting a permit from EOT...... (Which presumably not many people bothered with.)

Andrew
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Re: Renting AirBnb? Finance Ministry is looking for you..

Postby Carolina » Fri Sep 08, 2017 2:49 pm

They still have the EOT system as well. They are moving to catch up with all the others now (for tax) who have gone outside the EOT system by renting on Airbnb.

YoMo2
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Re: Renting AirBnb? Finance Ministry is looking for you..

Postby YoMo2 » Sun Sep 10, 2017 7:52 am

Carolina wrote:They still have the EOT system as well. They are moving to catch up with all the others now (for tax) who have gone outside the EOT system by renting on Airbnb.


Yes, exactly my point. When I spoke to EOT about this, they said that although owners can now self-register, there are still conditions to be met, and EOT can do spot checks too.....

Andrew
"It's all in the implementation"

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Re: Renting AirBnb? Finance Ministry is looking for you..

Postby Kilkis » Sun Sep 10, 2017 9:18 am

YoMo2 wrote:...They must have some reason for changing what was a quite complicated system of getting a permit from EOT...


I think the reason was that the way things are being done is changing so they wanted to change the registration system to reflect reality. Not that long ago things like AirBnB didn't exist. There were hotels and villas to let and that was it. EOT had a complicated and strict registration process for anybody who wished to let property in this way. With the advent of sites like AirBnB there arose a whole new category of people letting property on an ad hoc basis. They wouldn't meet the full strict EOT rules so could not register even if they wanted to. Also it probably wouldn't be cost effective for them to register if they did meet the rules. That left EOT with a number of choices:

    1 Make such lettings completely illegal and prosecute anybody caught doing it. That's going to make a lot of voters very angry and, knowing how much Greeks respect regulations, lettings would probably continue unregulated and untaxed anyway.
    2 Simply allow people to carry on letting in this way and ignore it. That's going to make a lot of people who have full registration, who are also voters, very angry and tends to facilitate tax avoidance.
    3 Introduce a second tier of registration, with simpler and less strict requirements, to cater for this new form of letting. That encourages people to register and hence encourages them to declare the income they earn to the tax authority.

They chose the last approach. In order not to undermine the full registration process, which is still active, they imposed restrictions on the amount of letting allowed under the simpler system. That means that hotels and villa rentals cannot simply switch to the simple system.

Warwick

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Re: Renting AirBnb? Finance Ministry is looking for you..

Postby Kathleen » Sun Sep 10, 2017 10:43 am

Friends are renting a village house under the new simplified system. They are restricted to maximum of 90days summer letting,through Air BnB and other sites, which they have to declare and pay 15% tax. Long term winter rental - 5 months - also has to be declared for tax purposes.

Kathleen

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Re: Renting AirBnb? Finance Ministry is looking for you..

Postby YoMo2 » Mon Sep 11, 2017 8:15 am

The full registration system also has a cap on total lettings time, 12 weeks in this case.

The interesting one is that the new system, I understand, specifically states you cannot provide any services. Apparently this includes wifi, aircon, and changing of bed linen.......

I wonder how many new registrations are legal under this condition?

Andrew
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Re: Renting AirBnb? Finance Ministry is looking for you..

Postby Kilkis » Mon Sep 11, 2017 9:06 am

YoMo2 wrote:The full registration system also has a cap on total lettings time, 12 weeks in this case...


If that had any validity then I think there must be more than one category of registration. The villas I know of that are fully legally registered with EOT are open from 1 April to 21 October and that is a lot more than 12 weeks. Also hotels are EOT registered and some of them stay open all year.

Warwick

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Re: Renting AirBnb? Finance Ministry is looking for you..

Postby Eleni13 » Mon Sep 11, 2017 10:01 am

You are correct Warwick. The original EOT rules still exist for those who want to let for any number of weeks to tourists. It has stringent rules regarding facilities with a points system to qualify, depending on tose facilities. There is no limit on the number of weeks that may be let.
Then there are two categories for a lmited period of letting. There are advantages in this because there is no renewal inspection as there is with the original EOT, no requirement To register as a business, a standard rate of tax is charged depending on the received income bracket. No allowances can be set against income. The maximum number of letting weeks allowed is 13. A form must be submitted via an accountant with details of the names and addresses of the visitors, ten days before the arrival of said visitors.
Then there is a modification of this shorter license which imposes the 'no services' rule. I paid little attention to the third category, as we were not planning to use it, but if anyone is interested, I will look it up. That third category is the one referred to by YoMo.
Nothing is ever simple here!

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Re: Renting AirBnb? Finance Ministry is looking for you..

Postby YoMo2 » Mon Sep 11, 2017 10:48 am

Kilkis wrote:
YoMo2 wrote:The full registration system also has a cap on total lettings time, 12 weeks in this case...


If that had any validity then I think there must be more than one category of registration. The villas I know of that are fully legally registered with EOT are open from 1 April to 21 October and that is a lot more than 12 weeks. Also hotels are EOT registered and some of them stay open all year.

Warwick


Well, I was ignoring the business licencing system as we seemed to be discussing the 2 property "soft" licence system and the new simple registration system. In both cases there is a limit on the number of weeks you can let out. A villa can be "open" for more than 12 weeks, as long as they only let less than 12 weeks. There is a difference.

I think the "no services" rule also applies to the "soft licence" category if my memory serves me right. I haven't checked, so I may be wrong.

Some clarification may be in order. Regarding the new registration system, The Living In Crete main site specifically states that you cannot provide wifi or aircon. There is no such stipulation in the law (4446/2016). The law states that you may not provide ANY services at all except bed linen. There is no mention of what constitutes a service. I suspect a lawyer or accountant has interpreted here. And I would further guess that you are only precluded from providing aircon or wifi if you charge separately for them. (This might be a way of filtering out hotels etc.) I can't see how even EOT would expect you to disable or remove aircon and wifi from your property.

Andrew
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Re: Renting AirBnb? Finance Ministry is looking for you..

Postby Carolina » Tue Sep 12, 2017 8:13 pm

YoMo2 wrote:Well, I was ignoring the business licencing system as we seemed to be discussing the 2 property "soft" licence system and the new simple registration system. ...
I think the "no services" rule also applies to the "soft licence" category if my memory serves me right. I haven't checked, so I may be wrong.
Andrew

I correct you Andrew, that is not the case with the 'soft' licence !

YoMo2 wrote:Regarding the new registration system, The Living In Crete main site specifically states that you cannot provide wifi or aircon. There is no such stipulation in the law (4446/2016). The law states that you may not provide ANY services at all except bed linen. There is no mention of what constitutes a service. I suspect a lawyer or accountant has interpreted here. And I would further guess that you are only precluded from providing aircon or wifi if you charge separately for them. (This might be a way of filtering out hotels etc.) I can't see how even EOT would expect you to disable or remove aircon and wifi from your property.
Andrew


I wasn't even aware this was on the site pages, so thank you, I will check. I think it was quoted from Atsalakis accountants who send updates for my website from time to time. I don't spend much time from April - October correcting and updating the website due to work commitments.

An EOT licence is still officially required to rent a property to a tour operator - this is what I was told by EOT in Heraklion a few months ago.

YoMo2
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Re: Renting AirBnb? Finance Ministry is looking for you..

Postby YoMo2 » Wed Sep 13, 2017 1:30 pm

Carolina wrote:
YoMo2 wrote:Well, I was ignoring the business licencing system as we seemed to be discussing the 2 property "soft" licence system and the new simple registration system. ...
I think the "no services" rule also applies to the "soft licence" category if my memory serves me right. I haven't checked, so I may be wrong.
Andrew

I correct you Andrew, that is not the case with the 'soft' licence !


My memory isn't that great, but in this case I think I was correct. In the interests of historical accuracy, (also known as hair-splitting), I refer you to the law introducing the "soft" licence, Law 4179/2013 Article 46, para 2. Last few words, "without supply of services". Obviously this may have been amended or superceded, in which case I give up..... :shock:

Andrew
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Re: Renting AirBnb? Finance Ministry is looking for you..

Postby Carolina » Wed Sep 13, 2017 4:06 pm

Andrew, I stand corrected! You are right, also my memory is not that great either! There is at least one amendment to 4179/2013 which is law 4873/2014 - which reduces the required minimum size of the villa (επαυλη) for a 'soft'licence from 100sqm το 80sqm, but haven't seen any amendments on supplying services so 'without supply of services' should be correct.

YoMo2
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Re: Renting AirBnb? Finance Ministry is looking for you..

Postby YoMo2 » Thu Sep 14, 2017 8:14 am

But typically vague, as you might expect, on what is meant by services..........

Andrew
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